Port Epoxy in a street engine?

[bobqzzi]

I've read in previous posts that there is a special epoxy that the drag race guys use in intake ports. The posters seemed to say that once it was in place that it lasted quite a long time, or forever. Since they were talking about drag engines, I was wondering if anyone had any experience with epoxy in a street engine- or any other engine that is required to run for extended periods and get hot. Any thoughts?

[bill jones]

-The first time I ever used epoxy I used Devcon "plastic aluminum.
-I was using a rectangle port manifold on an oval port BBC so I had to use a lot of epoxy to reshape the large ports.
-I did that over a period of about two weeks, putting the epoxy on in fairly thin smears.
-Some 15 years later I decided to remove that epoxy so I could use the manifold ontrectangle port heads again.
-I thought it would be a simple job to use a chisel and a hammer and knock it out in chunks, but that stuff was in there just like the parent metal.
-I couldn't believe it, that it could not be chipped away any easier than if you were trying to cut aluminum with the chisel.
-So my vote is to use Devcon "plastic aluminum" if it's an aluminum manifold.
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-I did make up a bent nose sharp edged prick so that I could spike up the metal on the port walls so the epoxy could get a good grip and I ground the ports walls with a stone prior to doing the prick marks and then immediately went about the task of smearing the epoxy before the aluminum could oxidize, then
-Once I got the first layer of epoxy on all 8 ports then I'd do an 8 port smear once in the morning and again in the evening.
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-It was a lot of work but I was 100% impressed that it stayed in there and was such a b-tch to remove.

[bobqzzi]

-The first time I ever used epoxy I used Devcon "plastic aluminum.
-I was using a rectangle port manifold on an oval port BBC so I had to use a lot of epoxy to reshape the large ports.
-I did that over a period of about two weeks, putting the epoxy on in fairly thin smears.
-Some 15 years later I decided to remove that epoxy so I could use the manifold ontrectangle port heads again.
-I thought it would be a simple job to use a chisel and a hammer and knock it out in chunks, but that stuff was in there just like the parent metal.
-I couldn't believe it, that it could not be chipped away any easier than if you were trying to cut aluminum with the chisel.
-So my vote is to use Devcon "plastic aluminum" if it's an aluminum manifold.
--------------------------------
-I did make up a bent nose sharp edged prick so that I could spike up the metal on the port walls so the epoxy could get a good grip and I ground the ports walls with a stone prior to doing the prick marks and then immediately went about the task of smearing the epoxy before the aluminum could oxidize, then
-Once I got the first layer of epoxy on all 8 ports then I'd do an 8 port smear once in the morning and again in the evening.
----------------------------------
-It was a lot of work but I was 100% impressed that it stayed in there and was such a b-tch to remove.

Thanks for the reply, I guess 15 years can be considered an extended period of time!
My application requires the epoxy be right up against the "ledge" formed by the bottom of the intake seat on the long side of the port, so I guess what I'm worried about is the heat. (This is a turbocharged 4 cylinder if it matters)

[Ape]

even though i never used i heard really good stories about manleys hight temperature liquid metal epoxy.
It´s not cheap but it lives up to higher temperatures than let´s say, jb-weld.
I did some port epoxying a cuple days ago with loctites liquid metal, and wasnt too thrilled about it, so next time either devcon or manleys.

regards

christian

[Ape]

Ooops forgot

what devcon# is adviceable for intake ports or heads or similar applications??

[Wolfplace]

Ooops forgot

what devcon# is adviceable for intake ports or heads or similar applications??

=
Splash Zone A788
This is the stuff you want I believe.
Check here
http://www.go2marine.com/frameset.jsp?s ... 357F/&df=3

[bill jones]

-Today and especially if I was going to epoxy up an intake port for use with a turbo, I'd practice on a sample head first and heat the head up and down thru enough cycles and rattle the head with an air hammer to see if the epoxy will crack or peel or rattle loose from the vibration and the heat.
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-I'd be concerned about the thin area or epoxy prior to the seat ring and the parting line at the underside of the seat ring.
-To have epoxy get loose in a turbo'd engine means certain failure when that epoxy gets into the turbo wheels.
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-I have used a lot of epoxies and some have come loose or peeled away but normally I use the Manley or the Edelbrock two part claylike epoxies that you have to mix and knead together by hand.
-I have used that Edelbrock epoxy in a set of Boss 302 Ford heads and filled the intake ports 60% (more than 1/2 full) from the floor to raise the port floor about 1.3".
-This was for a slightly street driven show car that sees maybe 400 miles a year and no problems with that.
-But I also installed metal posts up thru the floor to help secure the large quantities of epoxy.
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-I would NOT use ANY 5 minute epoxy of any brand because I have no faith in any of that stuff staying put because I've seen every brand I've tried eventually come loose.
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-One other thing is when the engine rattles from pinging or detonation the epoxy is subjected to severe vibration that will break it loose.

[Bos's5.0]

Bill,

How do you install the pins?

[Wolfplace]

Bill,
Don't know if you are referring to the Splash Zone but it is not a fast drying epoxy.
It is a two part epoxy that takes probably 12+ hours to set up, can be used under water, will stick to verticle surfaces,
I believe used by a lot of the top head guys which is a club that sadly I don't include myself in

I have seen it in 867 heads that had about a quarter inch in the bottoms of the ports right to the intake face, tapered to a feather edge down the port that were done about 8 years prior & the stuff was still rock solid.
It was put in with holes drilled through the bottoms of the port to lock it.

Also have a set of old Pontiac heads that were done somewhere down south many years ago & they have some thin filled areas in the intakes that are rock solid


I am pretty sure this is the same stuff Darin uses & is sold by Reher Morrison but Darin can answer that.
Check out the link above..

[Ape]

Wolfplace wrote
Took a look at the recomm. site, very nice

so splash zone a788 is that the type of devcon?
I got told that they supposedly hve running numbers for different apllications, so would that be the one for ports+heads. Devcon would be rather important since all the other stuff is here in central euope kind of hard to order, and devcon is english, maybe they even have it packed up in tubes, since i dont need that much cuz of lack of port volume(motorcycles)

regards

christian

Splash Zone A788
This is the stuff you want I believe.
Check here

[Wolfplace]

Wolfplace wrote
Took a look at the recomm. site, very nice

so splash zone a788 is that the type of devcon?
I got told that they supposedly hve running numbers for different apllications, so would that be the one for ports+heads. Devcon would be rather important since all the other stuff is here in central euope kind of hard to order, and devcon is english, maybe they even have it packed up in tubes, since i dont need that much cuz of lack of port volume(motorcycles)

regards

christian
Splash Zone A788
This is the stuff you want I believe.
Check here

=
This stuff was originally used to repair pilings & boat hulls underwater is my understanding & it isn't a Devcon product but I would think it would be available worldwide considering it's intended usage.
You can order it directly off that site but it comes in 1lb tins of each part.
I know of one person who has had some for at least 5 years & it still appears quite useful so it seems to have an excellent shelf life.
I have some that is at about two or three years old & I know it is still good.
You might email or call Darin Morgan & see if he has it in smaller quantities if this is what he in fact uses unless he happens by & sees this post

[bill jones]

-Bos,,,I drilled and tapped up thru the bottom of the Boss 302 heads and ran some 1/4-NC bolts up into the ports about an inch from the bottom, and did the same thing to the intake manifold.
-There is no water right there for the first couple of inches on many different V/8 style heads and I don't know if any manifolds that have much water to worry about.
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-Some guys do like Wolfy said and just drill a group of holes thru the port walls that don't go into water and push the epoxy thru those holes as they are installing the epoxy, so that gives the epoxy some legs to lock into the metal.
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-I've never used the splashzone stuff yet so I have no comment on it.

[Ape]

Hey thanks i´ll look further into it, especially the thing about the unused lifespan sunds rather tempting

regards christian

[Bos's5.0]

is that splash zone stuff a 2 part that you knead together?

[Boss 330]

Z Spar splash zone compound is available from...www.ruffstuff.com
It is a very thick two part epoxy. It has survived 400 degrees F cht and changed color a bit, but is still in the ports four years later. Once it sets about the only way to remove it is to grind it out.