-I'm needing to buy 100feet of sparkplug wire, and I'm looking at the MSD (8.8mm) superconductor which is 50 ohms per foot and costs about $95 for a 100 feet.
-Moroso has some 40 ohm 8.8mm wire at $165 for a 100 feet.
-------------------------------------
-Anybody have any specific thoughts about what to get?
-Most of the wire usage will be with MSD related products.
Best sparkplug wire in bulk quantity?
Moderator: Team
-
bill jones
- Guru
- Posts: 2651
- Joined: Sun Sep 05, 2004 6:38 pm
- Location: salt lake city, ut
- Contact:
Bill,
we did a series of test one time with a 650 hp bracket small block chev. Not sure if its what your looking for, but this is what we found. We tested every set of wires that we could get our hands on. As well as spark plugs and distributors (points vs. electronic).With the wires we went from prebuilt autolites from the local shucks to solid core msd. While the resistence in the wire did vary, it didn't seem to make a bit of difference power wise, at least in this application.About the only conclusion we came to is that the higher the resistance, the more load it would put on the ignition.I think at some point, or maybe in a more radical combo, that all of those things would matter. I also think that the lower resistance wire could allow your ignition system to last longer. Hope this is what your looking for?
shawn
we did a series of test one time with a 650 hp bracket small block chev. Not sure if its what your looking for, but this is what we found. We tested every set of wires that we could get our hands on. As well as spark plugs and distributors (points vs. electronic).With the wires we went from prebuilt autolites from the local shucks to solid core msd. While the resistence in the wire did vary, it didn't seem to make a bit of difference power wise, at least in this application.About the only conclusion we came to is that the higher the resistance, the more load it would put on the ignition.I think at some point, or maybe in a more radical combo, that all of those things would matter. I also think that the lower resistance wire could allow your ignition system to last longer. Hope this is what your looking for?
shawn
-
bill jones
- Guru
- Posts: 2651
- Joined: Sun Sep 05, 2004 6:38 pm
- Location: salt lake city, ut
- Contact:
-Actually I'm trying to conjure up a super high power ignition for the little pinto engine we run at Bonneville.
-Some day we intend to start pouring the nitro to it and I don't want to run a magneto so I'm using the highest power inductive system I can find which is the 20amp hei kit from MSD---and this is ran at the same time in conjunction with an MSD 6 (for now) thru a 3 coil post adapter like the nascar guys use for the second ignition system.
-I piddle around with this stuff and I have gone from the 4.5 amperes at 8000rpm that the standard 4 cylinder MSD6 uses, which is a pretty decent spark, to my current system which is about on par with or maybe even better than an MSD10 and uses something like 14 amperes at 8000rpm.
-The visual difference in the spark is huge now but I'm still using the older wires except for the two real short coil wires that connect to the 3 post adapter.
-I am using a 1400 OHM coil wire out of the 3 post adapter in to the distributor cap and it doesn't take long before you can feel heat in that one wire.
------------------------------
-I have used the 800 and 300 ohm per foot stuff with no problems for years and I have maybe 20 sets of that wire laying around but I don't want to be using that 800 or the 300 ohm stuff any longer.
------------------------------
-This superconductor wire is 8.5mm (not 8.8 like I mentioned earlier) and there are some issues with crimping and when I have to use the large wire down inside the female posts of the older style distributors I occasionally have to deal with, so I really don't want to run the 10.5mm wire.
------------------------------
-I have done the same exact type of tests on various plug wires once int ne late 1960's and again in the late 1980's on oval track cars and NEVER found anything that made the CAR faster, but that was all limited to a maximum primary amperage draw of 7.5 amps or less and using a singular system.
-I have several dual ignition systems running right now on various test cars but we haven't found any case where duals ignitions do sh-t yet.
-But some day I may find the perfect place for all my efforts.
-Some day we intend to start pouring the nitro to it and I don't want to run a magneto so I'm using the highest power inductive system I can find which is the 20amp hei kit from MSD---and this is ran at the same time in conjunction with an MSD 6 (for now) thru a 3 coil post adapter like the nascar guys use for the second ignition system.
-I piddle around with this stuff and I have gone from the 4.5 amperes at 8000rpm that the standard 4 cylinder MSD6 uses, which is a pretty decent spark, to my current system which is about on par with or maybe even better than an MSD10 and uses something like 14 amperes at 8000rpm.
-The visual difference in the spark is huge now but I'm still using the older wires except for the two real short coil wires that connect to the 3 post adapter.
-I am using a 1400 OHM coil wire out of the 3 post adapter in to the distributor cap and it doesn't take long before you can feel heat in that one wire.
------------------------------
-I have used the 800 and 300 ohm per foot stuff with no problems for years and I have maybe 20 sets of that wire laying around but I don't want to be using that 800 or the 300 ohm stuff any longer.
------------------------------
-This superconductor wire is 8.5mm (not 8.8 like I mentioned earlier) and there are some issues with crimping and when I have to use the large wire down inside the female posts of the older style distributors I occasionally have to deal with, so I really don't want to run the 10.5mm wire.
------------------------------
-I have done the same exact type of tests on various plug wires once int ne late 1960's and again in the late 1980's on oval track cars and NEVER found anything that made the CAR faster, but that was all limited to a maximum primary amperage draw of 7.5 amps or less and using a singular system.
-I have several dual ignition systems running right now on various test cars but we haven't found any case where duals ignitions do sh-t yet.
-But some day I may find the perfect place for all my efforts.
Now that i see what your application is, your right, i think that you do face a different type of challenge. Our stuff is almost always gas with the occasional alky motor.We haven't faced (at least that i'm aware of anyway) an ignition shortage or wire problem.
I know with the nitro stuff is all about the ignition. Tim Richards told me once that a nitro motor is nothing but a giant fuel pump and their just trying to figure out how to get it lit.
Have you looked into something other than a "designed" plug wire? I would think that the aero guys would have something that is small and lightweight that would handle the kind of amps that your generating.
good luck,
shawn
I know with the nitro stuff is all about the ignition. Tim Richards told me once that a nitro motor is nothing but a giant fuel pump and their just trying to figure out how to get it lit.
Have you looked into something other than a "designed" plug wire? I would think that the aero guys would have something that is small and lightweight that would handle the kind of amps that your generating.
good luck,
shawn
-
bill jones
- Guru
- Posts: 2651
- Joined: Sun Sep 05, 2004 6:38 pm
- Location: salt lake city, ut
- Contact:
-Really the application for the plug wire isn't just my toys, as what I learn during my testing usually always filter down to the ignitions I do for racers.
-By doing the testing and learning what works, I can show the people that I do their ignitions WHY something is better.
-Some engines I can perk up so easy because they have virtual junk combinations of stuff and they don't know how to maintain the cleanliness and they don't even know that setting timing at 3000rpm doesn't tell you one thing about what happens at race rpm, stuff like that.
----------------------------------
-I'd rather work with "obtanium parts" rather than something rare and
"unobtanium" and I don't really have any easy sources to "aero" industry and a lot of guys has garbage to work with so I have to make do sometimes with less than perfect so even then I have to know how to wring the most effeciency out of what they have sometimes.
-How much power do you think a 2000 pinto on 50 or 60 or 70 or 80% nitro will make?
-How much power and what percentage of nitro do you think we can get before we drive over the crankshaft?
-I've seen 30 more cubic inches go 55mph faster on 90% nitro than we have on methanol so that's sort of our challenge, to go where we've never been.
--------------------------------
-My pea shooter pinto ain't nothing like Tim Richards is used to but Bonneville's challenges sometimes lead you astray chasing the elusive mph we're all looking so desperately for.
-By doing the testing and learning what works, I can show the people that I do their ignitions WHY something is better.
-Some engines I can perk up so easy because they have virtual junk combinations of stuff and they don't know how to maintain the cleanliness and they don't even know that setting timing at 3000rpm doesn't tell you one thing about what happens at race rpm, stuff like that.
----------------------------------
-I'd rather work with "obtanium parts" rather than something rare and
"unobtanium" and I don't really have any easy sources to "aero" industry and a lot of guys has garbage to work with so I have to make do sometimes with less than perfect so even then I have to know how to wring the most effeciency out of what they have sometimes.
-How much power do you think a 2000 pinto on 50 or 60 or 70 or 80% nitro will make?
-How much power and what percentage of nitro do you think we can get before we drive over the crankshaft?
-I've seen 30 more cubic inches go 55mph faster on 90% nitro than we have on methanol so that's sort of our challenge, to go where we've never been.
--------------------------------
-My pea shooter pinto ain't nothing like Tim Richards is used to but Bonneville's challenges sometimes lead you astray chasing the elusive mph we're all looking so desperately for.
I don't know enough about nitro motors to help one way or the other. Or anything about those pinto motors either. lol. I would have to assume though that running 90% for the amount of time you guys are at wide open throttle would be tough to tune. You might try getting in contact with some of the a/fuel dragster guys. They seem to have a pretty good grip on what it takes to make those things run and live.At least for about 5 seconds or so. I don't think they would have any trouble sharing some tips with you since your not really competing with them. If you interested i'll try and get you some phone numbers.
shawn
shawn
Unless you're worried about RFI (radio frequency interference) affecting computer systems, why use anything but straight wire at a fraction of an ohm per foot? I would think insulation thickness/material would be for voltage,i.e. RFI and shorting. The resistance is going to cause heating and limit current.
It doesn't matter if the secondary puts out a million volts if it jumps the gap at 20,000, that's what the plug will see.Wider gap, more voltage to initate the arc. More current will produce more power (at the plug) since power is voltage times current.
Maybe MSD ignitions need resistance wire,I have no experience, just a general discussion.
It doesn't matter if the secondary puts out a million volts if it jumps the gap at 20,000, that's what the plug will see.Wider gap, more voltage to initate the arc. More current will produce more power (at the plug) since power is voltage times current.
Maybe MSD ignitions need resistance wire,I have no experience, just a general discussion.
-
bill jones
- Guru
- Posts: 2651
- Joined: Sun Sep 05, 2004 6:38 pm
- Location: salt lake city, ut
- Contact:
-I am concerned about RFI because about everybody runs digital or electronic ignitions and a lot of people are using data recorders.
-I have run solid core wires on MSD6's on oval track cars and never seen any problems tho.
-----------------------------------
-All of this is about me wanting to know CAN be done and then I need to apply what I find in enough different circumstances to see if I can find where the magic might be.
---------------------------------
-I have a pretty good idea of what path I'll take with the nitro, maybe it won't be right but I need to learn it myself.
-One guy who I really trust showed me exactly what he runs on his 151ci half a SBC but that is at the 90% level and I doubt that I dare start at 90%.
-I have run solid core wires on MSD6's on oval track cars and never seen any problems tho.
-----------------------------------
-All of this is about me wanting to know CAN be done and then I need to apply what I find in enough different circumstances to see if I can find where the magic might be.
---------------------------------
-I have a pretty good idea of what path I'll take with the nitro, maybe it won't be right but I need to learn it myself.
-One guy who I really trust showed me exactly what he runs on his 151ci half a SBC but that is at the 90% level and I doubt that I dare start at 90%.