Camshaft breakin, specifically flat tappet stuff.

speedtalk · Post by **speedtalk** » Wed Mar 10, 2004 5:19 pm

Factors you can control after the engine is in the car:

1) Lubrication
2) RPM
3) Force

So for each:

1) Not much you can do here. If adding extra oil doesn't become an aeration problem for bearings (I'm guessing it won't at idle), I'd say go for it.
2) Run at idle. You no longer need extra RPM because of #1
3) Use lower ratio rockers.

Just my thoughts.

rmbuilder · Post by **rmbuilder** » Thu Mar 11, 2004 8:43 am

Anyone doing run-in with single springs?
Bob

speedtalk · Post by **speedtalk** » Thu Mar 11, 2004 9:33 am

rmbuilder wrote:Anyone doing run-in with single springs?
Bob

Yes, thanks for adding that Bob.

guest · Post by **guest** » Thu Mar 11, 2004 3:47 pm

i have never had a cam wipe out in over twenty years . untill recently ! there is a definate problem with current lifters ! i used up all my eaton lifters three months ago , (i had several trays of them ) then i was forced to use current market lifters and the last two engines wiped cams ! has anybody used the CMD-HIGH PRESSURE LUBE #3 for a cam lube ? i was thinking about trying it because of what i had read about it . i got some now and it seems kind of thick , wich would be good because it wont drip of the cam before break in and it seems to proclaim more pressure resistance than anything on the market ?

speedtalk · Post by **speedtalk** » Thu Mar 11, 2004 4:14 pm

guest wrote:has anybody used the CMD-HIGH PRESSURE LUBE #3 for a cam lube ?

No, but I use it in plenty of other locations - good stuff.

Since we're on the subject, how about the relation between the lifter crown and the lobe taper? I've tried different tapers in the past - not sure that I learned anything

ShaunTiede/UltraDyne · Fri Mar 12, 2004 12:57 pm

Assuming the lifter bore angles are true, I have been having great results doing the following for a flat tappet break in: I clean everything in Lacquer Thinner. Then I coat the base of the lifters and the lobes with the Moly lube that A.R.P. supplies with their rod bolts. I put a coat of 5W20 oil such as SuperFlow or Havoline on the lifter body and the lifter bores. Then I put that oil in the pan for start up. Pre lube the system, start it up, and Idle it at 2Grand. Works great. It stopped anyone calling me with this issue. You can't break in a flat tappet cam with synthetic oil. The oil is so slick that it keeps the lifter from rotating which tracks it. Some may have done it and dodged a bullet, but you try it on one of our high peak rate ramps with any sort of spring pressure and you'll be sorry.

speedtalk · Post by **speedtalk** » Fri Mar 12, 2004 1:07 pm

ShaunTiede/UltraDyne wrote:You can't break in a flat tappet cam with synthetic oil. The oil is so slick that it keeps the lifter from rotating which tracks it.

Hey Shaun, Thanks for stopping by the forum.

I never thought of synthetic being a problem for the cam. Thanks for sharing your experience.

bsfc9 · Post by **bsfc9** » Sat Mar 13, 2004 9:27 am

has anyone heard about oil companies being required by the epa to remove certain anti-wear substances(phosphorus and zinc)from current oils(mineral based) and this leading to increased flat tappet cam wear and failure?

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Sat Mar 13, 2004 11:05 am

Yes that is true, but from what i understand its only being removed from highway oils, or non-racing oils. Apparently zinc and catalytic convertors don't mix. Most vehicles have roller cams these days and don't need the zinc anyway. They don't care about the rest of us.

learner · Post by **learner** » Sat Mar 13, 2004 11:55 am

Sorry, forgot to log in above.

bsfc9 · Post by **bsfc9** » Sat Mar 13, 2004 4:52 pm

learner, you mentioned "highway or non-racing" oils, so do you think for example valvoline's "race" oil is a better bet than regular valvoline, and are the other brands going to market there own "race" oil. ive also heard talk about sales restrictions on oils that are not approved for highway use. is the good oil going to go the way leaded fuel?--sure i can get it for my hot street car just not as easily or as cheap.

learner · Post by **learner** » Sat Mar 13, 2004 10:04 pm

I don't know for sure. I would suspect the racing oil would be better due to better or closer manufacturing tolerances. As far as zinc in highway oils, from what i understand you need to look for anything with an SJ or earlier rating. I'm told the SL's are zinc free. However, i do not have an oil contact per say.

Lasher... · Post by **Lasher...** » Sun Mar 14, 2004 12:49 am

Actually SL rated oils are not zinc free. A sample of oil can be sent to a lab and they can tell you some of the properties of your oil sample.

As an example here is an example of an SL rated 10W-30 I had done during 2003.These numbers are in Parts Per Million.

Molybdenum.......... = 46
Silicon................... = 2
Sodium................. = 1
Calcium................ = 1716
Magnesium............ = 11
Phosphorus ........... = 849
Zinc....................... = 947

SUS Viscosoity @ 210 F = 61
Flashpoint .................. = 430 deg F

SL rated oils have thier Phosphorus levels capped at 1000 PPM. The new GF-4 specs due out later this year will most likey be less than that. The EPA and other belive the Phosphorus is the leading killer of cat converters. Much of this Phosphorus comes from Zinc ( Zincdithiophosphate ).There is alot of debate that it's not really the PH 's fault but the vilotility of the oil instead......either way the new SM /GF-4 oils are very likely going to be a much different oil than the current crop of SL / GF-3 oils.

bsfc9 · Post by **bsfc9** » Sun Mar 14, 2004 7:02 pm

how about distributor drive gear failures linked to these changes in oil formulations? has anybody experienced this?

learner · Post by **learner** » Sun Mar 14, 2004 7:14 pm

No other failures that i'm aware of.

Good info lasher. Have you had any earlier oils tested to compare the levels of zinc and phosphorus? Or have you had any racing oils tested?

Thanks

Don Terrill’s Speed-Talk

Camshaft breakin, specifically flat tappet stuff.

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