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Wet Flow Test Pic...................AFR Chevy 235

General engine tech -- Drag Racing to Circle Track

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Cylinder Head Works Inc.

Wet Flow Test Pic...................AFR Chevy 235

Post by Cylinder Head Works Inc. »

Lets just put the Dry flow numbers aside and look at wet patterns. Looking at this port design How... and Why is this vane behind the guide.. angling toward the cylinder wall??? Today I spent sometime studying wet flow patterns of this new port and found area's similar to other heads in the market place but this vane or what I like to call " Deflector Block " angling the air stream toward the cylinder . ( Note: AMC had a very similar port in there V8 way back ) The area around the vane toward the seat had a huge amount of activity......Good. When you look at this PIC keep in mind this separation of air and fuel in the region is common with alot of 23 degree heads.

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View from manifold side with 2 inch thick entry plate.

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Here is the pic from the chamber side note the major air streams!! Three to be consistent , with stream # 1 following the chamber side of seat, not in the port side under the seat. The seat velocity is high in the .200 to .350 exhibiting turbulence, but the dry number is high .200-152.4 cfm , .300-216.3 cfm , with a venturi of 92%. If anybody has pics of burn patterns of this new head I would be very interested to see actual Burn VS Wet testing.

John
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Re: Wet Flow Test Pic...................AFR Chevy 235

Post by trmnatr »

Very good work =D>

This thread is gonna end up a big [-X

It's sad because this is the sort of thing that needs to be done on many heads just for info
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Re: Wet Flow Test Pic...................AFR Chevy 235

Post by lun40119 »

Great pics, thanks for sharing.............this goes to show that dry flow numbers aren't all that they are cracked up to be.
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Re: Wet Flow Test Pic...................AFR Chevy 235

Post by AA Performance »

Wet flow isn't the almighty either. The only real test is the track. But seings how it's started, lets keep it going. Should get quite interesting I'd say.
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Re: Wet Flow Test Pic...................AFR Chevy 235

Post by T-flow »

Thanks for your hard work, very nice post.
What does this sound like on the flow bench?
I also feel the track is the only true test place but, there are a number of things we can learn from all this. No, it's not the end-all.
What are the fps in the port?

Thanks for your time, T-flow
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Re: Wet Flow Test Pic...................AFR Chevy 235

Post by revolutionary »

These are from the March 2009 issue of PHR story on our 327 using AFR 210 heads.
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Image
Note the fuel pattern on the piston. very pronounced. On the runners I just ran a cartridge roll over the vane and didn't modify it at all. I believe the fuel was washing though pretty seriously which would explain why it wanted so much gas. Best power at .45bsfc and 37 degrees timing.
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Re: Wet Flow Test Pic...................AFR Chevy 235

Post by Keith Morganstein »

235 vs 227

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Image
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Re: Wet Flow Test Pic...................AFR Chevy 235

Post by governor »

Looks like V/P was a tade tight on that 327. One missed shift or over rev could be a problem.

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Re: Wet Flow Test Pic...................AFR Chevy 235

Post by Cylinder Head Works Inc. »

T-flow wrote:Thanks for your hard work, very nice post.
What does this sound like on the flow bench?
I also feel the track is the only true test place but, there are a number of things we can learn from all this. No, it's not the end-all.
What are the fps in the port?

Thanks for your time, T-flow
I haven't had a chance to check fps or probe the port to see what the velocity is like , this Vane or " Deflector Block " is currently a study point for other projects in the works. The port sounds clean on the big bore flow fixture 4.250 I also record the sound pattern too, but has dirty air with 4.00 fixture, this head is intended for 4.100 Plus bore sizes .....i'm guessing.

Revolutionary..Daryl thanks for the pics very interesting if you have any more of this engine can you please send them to me email: chwheads@telus.net this is just one more piece to the big puzzle !!

Revolutionary..Daryl thanks Again

John
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Re: Wet Flow Test Pic...................AFR Chevy 235

Post by BrazilianZ28Camaro »

revolutionary wrote:These are from the March 2009 issue of PHR story on our 327 using AFR 210 heads.
Image
Image
Note the fuel pattern on the piston. very pronounced. On the runners I just ran a cartridge roll over the vane and didn't modify it at all. I believe the fuel was washing though pretty seriously which would explain why it wanted so much gas. Best power at .45bsfc and 37 degrees timing.

What would be the relation of the big 210 runner (for a 327) relative to the burn pattern?

Too low air velocity can induce fuel rivulets? :roll:
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Re: Wet Flow Test Pic...................AFR Chevy 235

Post by blaktopr »

John,
Are you able to document the test while running with a pic or vid?
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Re: Wet Flow Test Pic...................AFR Chevy 235

Post by revolutionary »

I shrunk the runners on that down to 203cc's and was using a dual plane intake (1205 stock gasket size and kept the bowl big). Yeah that was pretty close on p-v. We just kept advancing it til it lost points then backed up a degree. Probably lost some due to valve motion from hitting the pistons.

I'll look and see if I have any more conclusive pictures.
Daryl

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Re: Wet Flow Test Pic...................AFR Chevy 235

Post by A Atwood »

Would be cool to dyno an engine back to back with those 235s in stock form and then grind out the vane and retest.

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Re: Wet Flow Test Pic...................AFR Chevy 235

Post by blaktopr »

revolutionary wrote:These are from the March 2009 issue of PHR story on our 327 using AFR 210 heads.
Image
Image
Note the fuel pattern on the piston. very pronounced. On the runners I just ran a cartridge roll over the vane and didn't modify it at all. I believe the fuel was washing though pretty seriously which would explain why it wanted so much gas. Best power at .45bsfc and 37 degrees timing.
By the looks of things, regardless of the vane there may be a heavy vortex behind the plug. On the piston there is a darker more sooty spot in that area. In the chamber, the plug is on the far side of the ridge. An area where high pressure hides.

John, try to probe those areas and look at what the vane does to the pressure differentials inside the port. Don't think of where you think the air wants to go. Get to those differentials and it will let you better understand what it does to the fluid.
Chris Sikorski
Cylinder Head Works Inc.

Re: Wet Flow Test Pic...................AFR Chevy 235

Post by Cylinder Head Works Inc. »

blaktopr wrote:John,
Are you able to document the test while running with a pic or vid?
Yes, to a point but the pics don't do the process justice, video camera with a super clear and crisp lens is what's in the works. It's been a chore to figure out a test method to capture the wet flow in Real Time manor and have it relate to the burn pattern, i'm not convinced the Mondello test method is the way to go, there's a marketing strategy at work there $$$$$, nor the Dart method . Understanding Wet Flow has to be related to something.................Burn pattern, just think of it this way the engine is an Air Pump...with Trace amounts of combustible fluid air born , not a fluid pump with trace amounts of air !!

I still have the head for a day so the probing the vane and port area has to get done , one more piece to the puzzle.


John
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