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DSS 427 SB Ford build

General engine tech -- Drag Racing to Circle Track

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David Vizard
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DSS 427 SB Ford build

Post by David Vizard » Sun Mar 13, 2016 1:49 pm

Guys,
I am building a 427 SB Ford using the very competitively priced DSS short block. The purpose of this build is to see just what can be had from 427 inches in terms of cost. The build is also a test motor for TFS twisted wedge 205 cc port 11R heads.

I would like any comments from anyone who has built a 427 using a stock block as a basis for such or anyone who has built a DSS 427.

Additionally any feed back from the heads would be nice.

Also I have not settled on the cam type here hyd. or solid nor the intake manifold single of two plane. Either way I am targeting a minimum of 600 lbs-ft from this build and it must be street drive-able on 87 octane fuel.

Your thoughts here gentleman!

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Re: DSS 427 SB Ford build

Post by MadBill » Sun Mar 13, 2016 2:47 pm

I vote for going big David. Unless it's going in a 4,000 lb. car with a 3.08 axle, a stout 427 should have more than enough low speed grunt without resorting to a DP manifold. Also, with the trend towards bushings, the reliability and low maintenance of solid rollers plus their added power potential tilts the scales in their favour.
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Re: DSS 427 SB Ford build

Post by 427dart » Sun Mar 13, 2016 2:51 pm

I built my Dart based 427 back in 2010 using the SCAT forged stroker kit with Probe dished pistons giving 10.3 compression with my TFS 225 High Port heads with 57 cc chambers.
My cam was a Lunati Voodoo series hyd. roller 241/249 with .600 lift intake & exhaust. Intake was the Eddy Super Vic with a custom AED 950 carb.
Makes for a great street/strip combo in my 3000 lb. "85 Mustang LX with TKO-600 trans and 3.50 gear.
Car has run 10.9 at 131.6 MPH and wasn't fully tuned in suspension wise with the 275x50x15 M/t drag radial which is a poor choice for a manual trans but great choice for street use.
Now after 6 yrs. it's still going strong and enjoy more summertime cruising than drag racing.
Currently working on the tune with my new dual Holley 600 setup using the PME dual quad intake for 351W.
I likes my nostalgia since when I was a teen the hot 427 Fords all had the medium or high riser 2x4 intakes!
Hey put the dual quads on it and have a ball! :D
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Re: DSS 427 SB Ford build

Post by 427dart » Sun Mar 13, 2016 2:56 pm

When you say stock block you mean a Ford 351w block? I would go for the Dart block for long term reliability and being able to use a larger bore for better head flow.

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Re: DSS 427 SB Ford build

Post by David Vizard » Sun Mar 13, 2016 3:18 pm

427dart wrote:When you say stock block you mean a Ford 351w block? I would go for the Dart block for long term reliability and being able to use a larger bore for better head flow.
I can see the point you are making here but going that route fails to test the products I am supposed to be testing i.e. the DSS kit and the TFS heads.
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Re: DSS 427 SB Ford build

Post by 427dart » Sun Mar 13, 2016 3:33 pm

Just for grins try a ported RPM Air Gap and see what you can get out of it compared to a Super Vic. Have never seen a good intake test done with a 427 Windsor.

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Re: DSS 427 SB Ford build

Post by MadBill » Sun Mar 13, 2016 4:31 pm

I have a great idea to create more work for you David. Whatever lifter type you choose for this engine, do a survey of SpeedTalkers for opinions on the best catalog cam for the application. Toss out the extremes, average the rest and select a cam that closely matches same to use as a baseline Vs. your COS cam selection. This approach should go a long way towards illustrating what the right cam can do and how far off (or on) many builders can be re the optimum specs.
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Re: DSS 427 SB Ford build

Post by 427dart » Sun Mar 13, 2016 4:46 pm

Yes make it an interesting and informative build other than the same ol' same ol'!

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Re: DSS 427 SB Ford build

Post by wjnielsen » Sun Mar 13, 2016 5:27 pm

MadBill wrote:I have a great idea to create more work for you David. Whatever lifter type you choose for this engine, do a survey of SpeedTalkers for opinions on the best catalog cam for the application. Toss out the extremes, average the rest and select a cam that closely matches same to use as a baseline Vs. your COS cam selection. This approach should go a long way towards illustrating what the right cam can do and how far off (or on) many builders can be re the optimum specs.
I second that - but would the folks underwriting this this endeavor be on board?

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Re: DSS 427 SB Ford build

Post by MadBill » Sun Mar 13, 2016 5:56 pm

wjnielsen wrote:
MadBill wrote:I have a great idea to create more work for you David. Whatever lifter type you choose for this engine, do a survey of SpeedTalkers for opinions on the best catalog cam for the application. Toss out the extremes, average the rest and select a cam that closely matches same to use as a baseline Vs. your COS cam selection. This approach should go a long way towards illustrating what the right cam can do and how far off (or on) many builders can be re the optimum specs.
I second that - but would the folks underwriting this this endeavor be on board?

-Bill
Well, for TFS it would show what their heads can do for the less technically-inclined hot rodder using a catalog cam and for David it should spotlight what the COS program can do to improve results for more exprienced builders. He could even compare a full custom COS spec cam to one of the program's 'best fit' shelf stick recommendations. Seems like a win-win...
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Re: DSS 427 SB Ford build

Post by Walter R. Malik » Sun Mar 13, 2016 6:09 pm

With that engine, I would get it around 10.5/1 to 11/1 compression and use an aggressive hydraulic roller lifter set-up for street use, (camshaft somewhere in the 255 to 260 at .050" range), and run the smaller Victor Jr. intake to achieve the peak torque you are after.
Of course, being that you are testing the TFS heads you might want to try their intake manifold that goes with them.

Just my opinions ... a 414" engine was pretty close and your using consensus better heads.
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Re: DSS 427 SB Ford build

Post by David Vizard » Mon Mar 14, 2016 7:04 pm

Walter R. Malik wrote:With that engine, I would get it around 10.5/1 to 11/1 compression and use an aggressive hydraulic roller lifter set-up for street use, (camshaft somewhere in the 255 to 260 at .050" range), and run the smaller Victor Jr. intake to achieve the peak torque you are after.
Of course, being that you are testing the TFS heads you might want to try their intake manifold that goes with them.

Just my opinions ... a 414" engine was pretty close and your using consensus better heads.
Walter,
Thanks for the input. I had intended to run a 10.5/1 CR but a cam somewhat smaller than you suggested here. I was thinking more in the 244/248 at 0.050 with a valve train that will deliver about 0.7 lift. As for the intake I had thought of testing on an Edelbrock Performer Air Gap and a Parker Funnel Web. I have a mod to the latter that bumps up output everywhere but is is a pain to do.
As for the cam I am as yet undecided as to whether it should be a Comp, Crane or Mike Jones. Might be interesting to see what brand ST posters would like to see used!

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Re: DSS 427 SB Ford build

Post by GARY C » Mon Mar 14, 2016 7:44 pm

As for the cam I am as yet undecided as to whether it should be a Comp, Crane or Mike Jones. Might be interesting to see what brand ST posters would like to see used!
Being a self employed small business owner myself my vote would go to Mike...His quality speaks for itself and the fact that he is doing the work will save you from having to send the other 2 company's cams to him for a cam dr print out. :D
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Re: DSS 427 SB Ford build

Post by RevTheory » Mon Mar 14, 2016 8:10 pm

I believe Howard's has the late Harold Brookshire's most-recent profiles. That's certainly something that's caught my interest.

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Re: DSS 427 SB Ford build

Post by The Radius Kid » Mon Mar 14, 2016 8:29 pm

GARY C wrote:Being a self employed small business owner myself my vote would go to Mike...His quality speaks for itself and the fact that he is doing the work will save you from having to send the other 2 company's cams to him for a cam dr print out. :D
Sounds like he should be "Jones-ing" for a good cam!
Did I just say that? :shock:
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