Best engine for a Q-ship?

[John Ross]

This really a "whole car" question, but I think the engine is the most important part of the puzzle.

If you wanted to build the ultimate sleeper, the fast car that doesn't draw a second glance, what would you do? As has been pointed out in another thread started by the guy who wants to build a 505-512 inch BBC for a '78 Malibu to recreate (and improve on) the car he had as a teenager, a healthy 500+ inch motor is going to fool NO ONE as soon as you turn the ignition key. If you want to attract zero attention driving to the grocery store, is a turbo motor the only way to go?

Secondly, what type of car would you choose as the basis for such a project? The goal here is to have a vehicle that does everything well, including roadrace course, but looks like something grandma might drive, so no Corvettes, Firebirds, Camaros, Mustangs, or any late-model vehicle typically marketed as a performance car. The only hint that things might not be what they seem should be tire tread and/or compound, and maybe the brakes, but nothing else should give the game up.

Budget for this project? Let's say $35K in parts, including buying the base vehicle.

Ideas? Could you improve on a used AMG C-class (that you de-badged) for this budget?

JR

[In-Tech]

For this example, how fast is fast in the quarter? How fast is fast top speed?

IMO I think turbo is the way to go for stealth underhood stuff with fairly quiet exhaust, the downfall is all the plumbing and all that heat. Then having different turbos or housings for road race vs drag or top speed. A nice stealthy engine package is a LS with a Whipple, very compact and short enough for almost any stock hood appearance installation.

[lefty o]

some big giant rusty boat of a car, with a mild big block with killer heads, and an intercooled procharger. folks wont know what out ran em till they are driving thru flying rust chunks.

[John Ross]

For this example, how fast is fast in the quarter? How fast is fast top speed?

SNIP

A nice stealthy engine package is a LS with a Whipple, very compact and short enough for almost any stock hood appearance installation.

As a point of comparison, a 2003-2006 E55 AMG is about 470 HP, 510 TQ, 4300 pounds with gas and driver, and is good for 12.8@116, 0-150 in 23 sec, and a top end north of 180 when de-governed. A nice one can be had for under $20K new with a warranty, but there are expensive potential maintenance issues.

I guess an LS with a Whipple has potential if muffled a bit and would not be too loud at school-zone throttle settings. The new supercharged LT4 engine is even lower profile, and can be had, paired with the 8-speed auto, for under $20K new with warranties, leaving $15K for the roller and brake/suspension/rearend mods. Suggestions for best sleeper cars to put this combo in (not necessarily GM) for light weight, decent aero, and ability to fit good brakes and suspension?

A "big, rusty boat" with a BBC would likely not do too well in the stopping and going fast around corners departments, and would always sound like a big motor, even at low speeds.

JR

[stealth]

Farm truck...

[In-Tech]

Lol, a farm truck or a big 'ol boat is a fun project for hurting someones feelings at a stop light but as mentioned, not so good at high speed nor corners.

I'm a pretty big fan of the LS and LT platform and transplants are fairly easy, especially supercharged. Is a 928 Porsche with a 1000hp LS out of the question? That AMG would be cool with a transplant too.

I'd like to hear other peoples ideas of cars that could be a great sleeper.

[lefty o]

didnt tell me it had to handle too!

[pdq67]

An old '73 Deuce and a Quarter hard top car here with a built 455 and 4 big/long muffles, (2 down each side), on it to quiet it down.

It might need a rear end gear swap but it should be a 10.5 second car for playing Sat nights. It has so much rear overhang that it will hook on spit!

And then there are the few and far between guys that take the little Chevy II '66 Deuce Coupe and turn it into a, "Crotch-Rocket", eater!

Take your pick, BUT I doubt if one car will do everything great like you would like to have.

And for that matter, a well built '67 Camaro will come damned close imho! Just get her down around 3,000 to 3.050 pounds or so!! 2,800 pounds would be even better! Think the, "Big Red 1", car here!!

pdq67

[John Ross]

LOL a 928 is not really a sleeper that Grandpa or Grandma might drive...

I've never been involved with a transplant involving an American V8 in a foreign car (yet), but if forced to, my inclination would be to try an LT4/8LE90 in a mid-90s Mercedes C220, with AMG suspension pieces and brakes...

JR

[In-Tech]

John, that AMG is something I had never paid attention to, it seems not many people do. I found this on ebay, wow $9K. http://www.ebay.com/itm/2005-Mercedes-B ... 2478302973

The brakes and suspension look great, screw compressor supercharged 24v engine(did I read that right, 3 valve per cylinder DOHC?) The M113 5.4L Supercharged is a supercharged and twin-intercooled version of the 5.4 L (5439 cc) M113 5.4. It is commonly referred to as "M113K" - where 'K' stands for Kompressor (supercharger). Output varies depending on year and model, from 469 hp for the E55 AMG at 6100 rpm to 582 hp in the 2004-2006 CLK DTM AMG, with 516 ft·lb(700 Nm) to 590 ft·lb(800 Nm) of torque at 2750-4000 rpm.

~332 cu in, It's got my attention now.

[barnym17]

73 to76 Malibu 4 door suspension geometry designed for Nascar,many suspension upgrades available.engine is. Set back giving near 50/50 wight distribution and it sure looks like a granny car.Aluminum heads on big block for weight reduction and quiet exhaust.

[n2xlr8n]

In my 35 years of building cars, one of the best sleepers I have ever witnessed was a 90s vintage Subaru Legacy Wagon.

Faded paint, quiet as a church mouse and it would go 9.80s all day long. AWD 2.6L boxer with 78 lb/min shoved through it.

It actually handled really well, as it had STi suspension. The guy had about 25k in it.

[pamotorman]

I had a 74 1500 Silverado with a aluminum headed 482 cu in BBC with a turbo 400 and 3.73 rear gear and carried either dirt bikes or snowmobile in the bed for traction. mild hyd cam and 750 holley with vacuum secondary

[Racing68]

About a week ago at the dragstrip i saw a shit box volvo stationwagon click off a 9.95 1/4. It sounded like lots of boost and good exhaust. No sound other than a whistle and squeeking tires.

[cv67]

anyhting not too heavy even a 4 door ponitiac olds, something that was never real popular
use the beststraight through muffs underneath and a huge turbo style suitcase muffler in front of the tank

a 4 link type rearend???


maybe an olds omega, beat up malibu wagon? they are cheap!