New domain: www.Speed-Talk.com

The forum is currently running on the new domain and server. The old domain will remain active for a while to forward any (less frequent) visitors.
Update your bookmarks to https://www.speed-talk.com or
https://www.speed-talk.com/forum/

BEST SPARK PLUG WIRES

General engine tech -- Drag Racing to Circle Track

Moderator: Team

David Redszus
Guru
Guru
Posts: 7182
Joined: Tue Nov 27, 2007 9:27 am
Location: Chicago
Contact:

Re: BEST SPARK PLUG WIRES

Post by David Redszus » Tue Feb 26, 2019 11:24 am

Truckedup wrote:
Tue Feb 26, 2019 9:25 am
Ok, does it make any difference where the RFI suppression come from and where it's located on the ignition wires ? Can it be a resistor plug cap or a resistor plug or resistor wires?
The very best plug wires from a conductance perspective are multi-strand copper wires.

From a RFI perspective, solid core wires will act as broadcast antenna transmitting the ringing voltages to other wires.
The insulating propertiy of plug wires is quite important, possibly equally important to low resistance wires.

But where does the RFI originate? We have used copper mesh shielded wires, grounded wires, and all sorts of "trick" wires.
The RFI comes from ringing voltages created when the firing voltage drops at an air gap. Where are the air gaps? At each spark plug and at the distributor cap rotor/post gap. High resistance connectors at each end of the plug wire will dampen the ringing. Ringing can be determined by holding a scope probe at various points along the secondary wire path.

Or, bag the whole problem and go to a coil over plug system.

Truckedup
Guru
Guru
Posts: 2065
Joined: Mon Jan 21, 2013 2:41 pm

Re: BEST SPARK PLUG WIRES

Post by Truckedup » Tue Feb 26, 2019 11:46 am

David Redszus wrote:
Tue Feb 26, 2019 11:24 am
Truckedup wrote:
Tue Feb 26, 2019 9:25 am
Ok, does it make any difference where the RFI suppression come from and where it's located on the ignition wires ? Can it be a resistor plug cap or a resistor plug or resistor wires?
The very best plug wires from a conductance perspective are multi-strand copper wires.

From a RFI perspective, solid core wires will act as broadcast antenna transmitting the ringing voltages to other wires.
The insulating propertiy of plug wires is quite important, possibly equally important to low resistance wires.

But where does the RFI originate? We have used copper mesh shielded wires, grounded wires, and all sorts of "trick" wires.
The RFI comes from ringing voltages created when the firing voltage drops at an air gap. Where are the air gaps? At each spark plug and at the distributor cap rotor/post gap. High resistance connectors at each end of the plug wire will dampen the ringing. Ringing can be determined by holding a scope probe at various points along the secondary wire path.

Or, bag the whole problem and go to a coil over plug system.
My bikes, like almost all bikes, are a coil near plug like an LS Chevy..If I understand this, the wires themselves transmit the ringing or RFI ,so do the carbon core or spiral wound wires prevent that? Then something is still needed near the air gap at the plug like a resistor terminal pr spark plug?
Motorcycle land speed racing... wearing animal hides and clinging to vibrating oily machines propelled by fire

Schurkey
HotPass
HotPass
Posts: 1391
Joined: Sun Mar 01, 2009 2:42 am
Location: The Seasonally Frozen Wastelands

Re: BEST SPARK PLUG WIRES

Post by Schurkey » Tue Feb 26, 2019 11:00 pm

Truckedup wrote:
Tue Feb 26, 2019 9:25 am
Ok, does it make any difference where the RFI suppression come from and where it's located on the ignition wires ? Can it be a resistor plug cap or a resistor plug or resistor wires?
Far as I know, the RFI is a result of amperage in the conductor creating an electromagnet, with the length of the conductor acting as a broadcast antenna.

A resistor that reduces the amperage also reduces the electromagnetic effect. A resistor ANYWHERE in the circuit will drop the amperage.

So, yes, a resistor "pellet" in the spark-plug cap that the Japanese are so fond of, or resistor plugs, or resistor wires, or any other method or placement of resistance in the secondary circuit will be effective. The only thing that matters is whether there's "enough" resistance.

Image

Another way to solve the same problem is to use shielded wires, or a shield over the wires, that "encloses" the RFI. This is typically more-expensive, and harder to incorporate into the vehicle design.

A third way is to create a "choke" for the current (amperage) of the secondary circuit to flow through. It reduces the current flow via inductance instead of resistance. Thus is born the "helical"- or "spiral"-core plug wires. Make no mistake--they're still killing the amperage, but they're doing it in a way that doesn't show up on an ohmmeter.

Truckedup
Guru
Guru
Posts: 2065
Joined: Mon Jan 21, 2013 2:41 pm

Re: BEST SPARK PLUG WIRES

Post by Truckedup » Wed Feb 27, 2019 9:04 am

More of my hillbilly tuning...About 15 years ago I built the vintage GMC 302 inline 6...The ignition was a stock points distributor with a modified advance using spiral wound wires and non resistor plugs...While tuning the small AFB carb for part throttle it had a stumble when the throttle was opened slightly.Was not the accelerator pump and I didn't want to richen the mixture so I swapped on a set of copper core plug wires ....It ran perfectly...
Then I got a Mallory multi spark box, used it with the points and went back to the spiral wires and there was no stumble..
So it appeared the points ignition didn't have enough energy to fire a lean mixture with any suppression in the system...I believe the wires shortened the spark duration more than the actual voltage?
Motorcycle land speed racing... wearing animal hides and clinging to vibrating oily machines propelled by fire

makin chips
Pro
Pro
Posts: 224
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2019 6:15 am

Re: BEST SPARK PLUG WIRES

Post by makin chips » Fri Mar 01, 2019 1:48 pm

Dave Koehler wrote:
Sun Feb 24, 2019 4:46 pm
Anyone ever wonder what company makes the actual plug wires?
These wires are then advertised as god's gift to racers by race companies in different colors.

Could it be someone like this> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjF4NqMVbQk

I think I have used every brand and color with the appropriate BS thrown at us over the years.
This includes cheap, over priced and sponsor supplied sets.
I can't say that I ever ran one that did not work out of the box.
I did cycle them out as is the norm from use or maintenance checks.
Since there is no HP gain from one brand or color to the next I quit worrying over this long ago.

Back when we only had solid core wires I think I changed them more often but they were easy to tell when they were failing.
Standard produces a lot of parts for a lot of people. Most of the parts stores' get their stuff from Standard. They produce BWD, TechSmart, 4 Seasons, and a bunch of other stuff, AFAIK. They also produce a bunch of white-label stuff for them, also, IIRC.

Jeff Lee
Pro
Pro
Posts: 311
Joined: Sun Jun 26, 2011 1:20 am
Location: Anthem / Phoenix Arizona

Re: BEST SPARK PLUG WIRES

Post by Jeff Lee » Sun Mar 03, 2019 12:51 am

I have bought these Scott Plug Wires. Quality construction in any color you want (I got the basic grey). Engine is almost done. Waiting on head gaskets on order. They are in Mooresville, NC NASCAR country so must be good!
https://sparkplugwires.com/spark-plug-wire-technology/
NHRA SS/H
1970 AMX
390 4-speed
Advanced Clutches
Red Line Racing Cams

makin chips
Pro
Pro
Posts: 224
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2019 6:15 am

Re: BEST SPARK PLUG WIRES

Post by makin chips » Sun Mar 03, 2019 3:43 am

Jeff Lee wrote:
Sun Mar 03, 2019 12:51 am
I have bought these Scott Plug Wires. Quality construction in any color you want (I got the basic grey). Engine is almost done. Waiting on head gaskets on order. They are in Mooresville, NC NASCAR country so must be good!
https://sparkplugwires.com/spark-plug-wire-technology/
It wouldn't surprise me to find that these and the Firecore 50s are made by the same place. I'd expect something like that. Anybody know where Scotts components are made at before they assemble them into custom wire sets?

tenxal
Expert
Expert
Posts: 536
Joined: Sun Nov 17, 2013 8:48 pm

Re: BEST SPARK PLUG WIRES

Post by tenxal » Sun Mar 03, 2019 8:27 am

Jeff Lee wrote:
Sun Mar 03, 2019 12:51 am
I have bought these Scott Plug Wires. Quality construction in any color you want (I got the basic grey). Engine is almost done. Waiting on head gaskets on order. They are in Mooresville, NC NASCAR country so must be good! https://sparkplugwires.com/spark-plug-wire-technology/
Scott wires are the best wires I've ever used.

twl
Expert
Expert
Posts: 674
Joined: Thu Feb 21, 2013 11:13 am

Re: BEST SPARK PLUG WIRES

Post by twl » Sun Mar 03, 2019 8:57 am

Truckedup wrote:
Tue Feb 26, 2019 9:25 am
Ok, does it make any difference where the RFI suppression come from and where it's located on the ignition wires ? Can it be a resistor plug cap or a resistor plug or resistor wires?
In most cases, just one 5kΩ suppressor in the HT line is sufficient. Most often that comes as a resistor spark plug. More resistors, such as resistive carbon suppressor wires, in the line only cause the spark to be weaker.
In all our applications with electronic ignition, a resistor plug works great. In our points/condenser applications we use all copper wire and a non-resistor plug.
Maybe if your ignition/computer is ultra sensitive to EMI, then look further.

User avatar
BigBlockMopar
Momentary Specialist
Momentary Specialist
Posts: 204
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2016 8:53 pm
Location: Netherlands
Contact:

Re: BEST SPARK PLUG WIRES

Post by BigBlockMopar » Sun Mar 03, 2019 3:16 pm

I'm running a MegaSquirt ECU with solid core wires and resistor plugs.
When I turn on the AM-radio in the car with the engine running, the speaker sounds like a Geiger counter in close range of a radioactive source.

But with the built-in noise filters I was able to filter out any noise or 'fake' trigger-signals on the MS.

twl
Expert
Expert
Posts: 674
Joined: Thu Feb 21, 2013 11:13 am

Re: BEST SPARK PLUG WIRES

Post by twl » Mon Mar 04, 2019 7:02 am

In some cases of common chassis ground, it could be beneficial to install a radio suppression capacitor on the ignition, if it doesn't pose any issue with the other electronics.
1 to 3 microfarad at 50v should do, or just ask for a radio suppression capacitor at your local auto supply.

pdq67
Guru
Guru
Posts: 8404
Joined: Thu Mar 04, 2010 8:05 pm

Re: BEST SPARK PLUG WIRES

Post by pdq67 » Mon Mar 04, 2019 7:24 am

Taylor solid copper and no resisters for the way old style point distributor I am going to use.

pdq67

ProPower engines
Guru
Guru
Posts: 7504
Joined: Sun Jan 21, 2007 1:16 pm
Location: VICTORIA BC CANADA

Re: BEST SPARK PLUG WIRES

Post by ProPower engines » Tue Mar 05, 2019 5:55 pm

pdq67 wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 7:24 am
Taylor solid copper and no resisters for the way old style point distributor I am going to use.

pdq67
You would be better off using the spiral wound wires as they last longer and are the same as the solid core wires for 0 resistance and no voltage leaks after a couple years of use. =D>

I have seen those wires cause no start issues when its a damp day and above normal humidity causing the wires to short out to the engine and cause hard starting issues. [-X
Real Race Cars Don't Have Doors

User avatar
af2
HotPass
HotPass
Posts: 6504
Joined: Sun Jan 28, 2007 4:42 pm
Location: Grass Valley, CA :Northern Foothills

Re: BEST SPARK PLUG WIRES

Post by af2 » Tue Mar 05, 2019 7:06 pm

Turn the lights off at night and see what is going on..
GURU is only a name.
Adam

DCal
Expert
Expert
Posts: 560
Joined: Fri Aug 11, 2006 11:37 am
Location: mooresville nc

Re: BEST SPARK PLUG WIRES

Post by DCal » Wed Mar 06, 2019 10:06 am

tenxal wrote:
Sun Mar 03, 2019 8:27 am
Jeff Lee wrote:
Sun Mar 03, 2019 12:51 am
I have bought these Scott Plug Wires. Quality construction in any color you want (I got the basic grey). Engine is almost done. Waiting on head gaskets on order. They are in Mooresville, NC NASCAR country so must be good! https://sparkplugwires.com/spark-plug-wire-technology/
Scott wires are the best wires I've ever used.
.
Brian Scott was in his office before and after I was in my office nearly every day. Upon his untimely death my friend (and Brian's best friend) Mark Vieau obtained Scott wires and has done wonders with the business, having re-organized into a modern efficient workplace with 4 fulltime employees and much faster delivery. I think Brian would be happy

Post Reply