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Simple Tunnel ram Question

General engine tech -- Drag Racing to Circle Track

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SchmidtMotorWorks
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Re: Simple Tunnel ram Question

Post by SchmidtMotorWorks » Sat Jun 15, 2019 4:52 pm

Kevin Johnson wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 4:11 pm
SchmidtMotorWorks wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 3:06 pm
Kevin Johnson wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 2:14 pm
Imagine a rocket in space using the maneuvering thrusters in combination to produce forward thrust. With a sufficiently long burn they could accelerate the rocket to the same velocity as a very short burn of the main engine.

Do you agree?

Yes, how does that relate to the question at hand?
It is an opportunity for you to reevaluate your previous remark below. Now you know of at least one parallel case where it it is incorrect. The mass contained within a flow can be compared to the mass of the rocket.
SchmidtMotorWorks previously wrote: If they end up at the same flow, that would be because the force was equal.
If the force is equal, the acceleration is equal.
Safety engineers go to great lengths with crumple zones to reduce the rate at which an automobile, and passenger within, ends up at a terminal velocity of zero.

Do you agree that it is important that some of the mass in the considered grouping of automobile and passenger arrives at terminal velocity later rather than sooner?

Diagram your argument, you have not shown how it is related.

Please just stick to diagramming the question at hand.

The diagram makes it easy to understand and see if it is correct or if something has been left out.

If you can't diagram it, then I don't think you have a case.

Keep in mind, physical test does not show any difference.
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Re: Simple Tunnel ram Question

Post by Kevin Johnson » Sat Jun 15, 2019 5:11 pm

SchmidtMotorWorks wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 4:52 pm
Kevin Johnson wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 4:11 pm
Imagine a rocket in space using the maneuvering thrusters in combination to produce forward thrust. With a sufficiently long burn they could accelerate the rocket to the same velocity as a very short burn of the main engine.

Do you agree?
SchmidtMotorWorks wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 3:06 pm



Yes, how does that relate to the question at hand?
It is an opportunity for you to reevaluate your previous remark below. Now you know of at least one parallel case where it it is incorrect. The mass contained within a flow can be compared to the mass of the rocket.
SchmidtMotorWorks previously wrote: If they end up at the same flow, that would be because the force was equal.
If the force is equal, the acceleration is equal.
Safety engineers go to great lengths with crumple zones to reduce the rate at which an automobile, and passenger within, ends up at a terminal velocity of zero.

Do you agree that it is important that some of the mass in the considered grouping of automobile and passenger arrives at terminal velocity later rather than sooner?

Diagram your argument, you have not shown how it is related.
Please diagram your argument that:
SchmidtMotorWorks previously wrote: If they end up at the same flow, that would be because the force was equal.
If the force is equal, the acceleration is equal.

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Re: Simple Tunnel ram Question

Post by Kevin Johnson » Sat Jun 15, 2019 5:21 pm

SchmidtMotorWorks wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 4:52 pm
...
Diagram your argument, you have not shown how it is related.

Please just stick to diagramming the question at hand.

The diagram makes it easy to understand and see if it is correct or if something has been left out.

If you can't diagram it, then I don't think you have a case.

Keep in mind, physical test does not show any difference.
I think you have been caught here and are trying your best to deflect and throw off the hook.

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Re: Simple Tunnel ram Question

Post by Kevin Johnson » Sat Jun 15, 2019 5:24 pm

Three more posts will bring you to 10,000

Congrats!

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Re: Simple Tunnel ram Question

Post by SchmidtMotorWorks » Sat Jun 15, 2019 7:20 pm

Kevin Johnson wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 5:21 pm
SchmidtMotorWorks wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 4:52 pm
...
Diagram your argument, you have not shown how it is related.

Please just stick to diagramming the question at hand.

The diagram makes it easy to understand and see if it is correct or if something has been left out.

If you can't diagram it, then I don't think you have a case.

Keep in mind, physical test does not show any difference.
I think you have been caught here and are trying your best to deflect and throw off the hook.
Present your case with a diagram please.
Then will have something tangible to discuss.
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Re: Simple Tunnel ram Question

Post by Kevin Johnson » Sat Jun 15, 2019 7:27 pm

Image

Pretty damn good diagram.

Been around the block a few times, Jon.

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Re: Simple Tunnel ram Question

Post by SchmidtMotorWorks » Sat Jun 15, 2019 7:36 pm

Kevin Johnson wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 7:27 pm
Image

Pretty damn good diagram.

Been around the block a few times, Jon.
^^^^Turns to baseless ad hominem when called on (and unable) to diagram his argument^^^^
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Re: Simple Tunnel ram Question

Post by Kevin Johnson » Sat Jun 15, 2019 7:39 pm

One more post to go, Jon!

Philosophy majors in logic see through BS fairly easily.

Please diagram the position you put forward, please, please. (Please^n)

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Re: Simple Tunnel ram Question

Post by digger » Sat Jun 15, 2019 7:48 pm

so back onto useful discussions....

can we all agree gravity has an effect, but its just negligilbe?

if you dont then provide a calculation or test as some kind of evidence.

no more bad anaologies please !!!

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Re: Simple Tunnel ram Question

Post by Kevin Johnson » Sat Jun 15, 2019 7:56 pm

I think a problem is that engineers cannot calculate in a timely manner individual vector diagrams for 6.022×1023 atoms per mol and so appeal to probability. Einstein specifically mentions this when expounding on Brownian Motion. When an argument is made that attempts to identify salient points of contention within the movements by these atoms or particles the mathematics already bog down the framing -- they have been normalized.

This bothers some people and others not so much.

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Re: Simple Tunnel ram Question

Post by SchmidtMotorWorks » Sat Jun 15, 2019 7:56 pm

digger wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 7:48 pm
so back onto useful discussions....

can we all agree gravity has an effect, but its just negligilbe?

if you dont then provide a calculation or test as some kind of evidence.

no more bad anaologies please !!!
I am not aware of an argument that it even makes a negligible difference.

As was stated previously, the head in the upward facing column is equal to the column of air adding to atmospheric pressure in the lower entry.

If gravity did make a difference, that would make a gravity powered perpetual motion device.
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Re: Simple Tunnel ram Question

Post by Kevin Johnson » Sat Jun 15, 2019 8:07 pm

This is exactly what is scary. People surrendering their intellect to what can be calculated by a Turing Machine.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Infinity

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Re: Simple Tunnel ram Question

Post by digger » Sat Jun 15, 2019 8:13 pm

SchmidtMotorWorks wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 7:56 pm
digger wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 7:48 pm
so back onto useful discussions....

can we all agree gravity has an effect, but its just negligilbe?

if you dont then provide a calculation or test as some kind of evidence.

no more bad anaologies please !!!
I am not aware of an argument that it even makes a negligible difference.

As was stated previously, the head in the upward facing column is equal to the column of air adding to atmospheric pressure in the lower entry.

If gravity did make a difference, that would make a gravity powered perpetual motion device.
change in potential energy is real

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Re: Simple Tunnel ram Question

Post by Kevin Johnson » Sat Jun 15, 2019 8:14 pm

SchmidtMotorWorks wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 7:56 pm
...
If gravity did make a difference, that would make a gravity powered perpetual motion device.
Please, do not contemplate becoming a patent clerk. It has been brought up numerous times that work is being performed to rarify the atmosphere prior to the considered parcel or ensemble of flow.

I totally get describing something as insignificant. I get disturbed when it is apparent the underlying physics and mathematics is not understood.

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Re: Simple Tunnel ram Question

Post by SchmidtMotorWorks » Sat Jun 15, 2019 9:04 pm

digger wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 8:13 pm
change in potential energy is real
In this diagram, what potential energy is different for port A vs B?

Port A has the height of h1
Port B has the height of h1 +h2 - h2
(both = h1)
tunnel_ram.jpg
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