New SBC Manifold with tooling

[naukkis79]

When I think bout a NA engine, I don't think of the air as flowing into the carb then turning down into a runner. I think of it as a runner pulling the charge from the plenum, it pulls all around, top, bottom and some from even inside the runners next to it.

Non-vaporized fuel travels extremely slowly compared to air. So with that kind of manifold I think your center cylinders will get much more fuel than outer ones. X-type manifold is all about equal length flow path to each runner to keep fuel distribution in control.

[Newold1]

Nice work on design, casting and work so far.

Who is doing the casting and core work? Buddy Bar?

This is evoking the intake charge being pulled through a manifold. Not the case. it's pressure differential that allow the air to move thru the manifold, down the ports and into the cylinder. Air does not like to turn sharp corners or radical change of direction on it's journey and efficiency is lost when it has to.

Your large plenum in your H-design will somewhat help with feeding those end runners.

Will this be a carb or EFI intake or both?

When it's ready for a set of heads, might be a good idea to run the intake on a head and use a carb body or throttle body with a viewing window and run it as a unit with both some smoke and short yarn pieces fastened in the plenum to see the directions and disturbances taking place in the intake manifold.

Air never really does what one initially thinks in a manifold. That's been my experiences.

[JoePorting]

Buddy Bar did the head casting. Lynnwood Pattern did the manifold casting, and Paul Rock did all the pattern work.

www.rockpattern.com
www.lynwoodpattern.com
www.buddybarcasting.com

This manifold is a Low Port design that is made to fit under a hood, so that's why it's lower than usual. The carb pad is about one inch taller than a Super Vic.

[BOOT]

When I think bout a NA engine, I don't think of the air as flowing into the carb then turning down into a runner. I think of it as a runner pulling the charge from the plenum, it pulls all around, top, bottom and some from even inside the runners next to it.

Non-vaporized fuel travels extremely slowly compared to air. So with that kind of manifold I think your center cylinders will get much more fuel than outer ones. X-type manifold is all about equal length flow path to each runner to keep fuel distribution in control.

Actually after my post it did occur to me the OP never mentioned if this was designed for a carb, TBI or port injection. Of course i don't see any bosses for injectors but that doesn't mean they won't be added. Even so I don't think it would be much diff if any from what I see of the casting.

[David Vizard]

This is what I was thinking the flow would do in the manifold. This is from my Solidworks file.

Manifold21.jpg

This is how the manifold ports will align up with the head. My idea was to make the manifold an extension of the intake port. This is how I think cylinder head companies should make heads and manifolds. They should make heads and manifolds that actually fit together and are made to work together.

Manifold100.jpg

Been through all the pics here. I think I have an application already. Keep on with this project as I think it will become a manifold milestone.
DV

[psychomotors]

Not that my opinion matters but "very cool".

[PRH]

Looking forward to reading about you having the new top end up and running on a motor.

[JoePorting]

This is what I was thinking the flow would do in the manifold. This is from my Solidworks file.

Manifold21.jpg

This is how the manifold ports will align up with the head. My idea was to make the manifold an extension of the intake port. This is how I think cylinder head companies should make heads and manifolds. They should make heads and manifolds that actually fit together and are made to work together.

Manifold100.jpg

Been through all the pics here. I think I have an application already. Keep on with this project as I think it will become a manifold milestone.
DV

Thanks David. You're only seeing the tip of the iceberg here. The head is being cast with a Printed Sand Casting Mold which means I'll be able to change the guts of the head any way I want. I have a bunch of crazy designs to test. This head configuration will allow me to test all my crazy ICE theories. Maybe some of them will actually work.

[cardo0]

When I think bout a NA engine, I don't think of the air as flowing into the carb then turning down into a runner. I think of it as a runner pulling the charge from the plenum, it pulls all around, top, bottom and some from even inside the runners next to it.

Non-vaporized fuel travels extremely slowly compared to air. So with that kind of manifold I think your center cylinders will get much more fuel than outer ones. X-type manifold is all about equal length flow path to each runner to keep fuel distribution in control.

I would have to agree with that but I'm no intake design expert by any means. I would expect the H design would need something like the Turtle used in X runner/plenum designs to direct flow more equally. Every turn a mixture charge has to make reduces the pressure signal filling the cylinder.

[Morgo]

Errr... wouldn't it be more efficient to have manifold 3D plastic printed before making cast moulds?Yeah,the printed sand moulds are just as fine but the testing if the design is effective would be much more faster and productive by plastic prints.But it's your project;go as you like!
Great that someone tackles the so old desing and found something!

[SchmidtMotorWorks]

Runner openings with a wall on one side as you have on the ends will not have a clean wave reflection.

A shelf below the carb pad will cause volumes of recirculating flow. (same issue in your chamber)
Recirculating flow can measure well in a flow bench but will cause problems in a running engine.

Listen to CFD results more, flow benches and pattern makers less.

[Warp Speed]

Runner openings with a wall on one side as you have on the ends will not have a clean wave reflection.

A shelf below the carb pad will cause volumes of recirculating flow. (same issue in your chamber)
Recirculating flow can measure well in a flow bench but will cause problems in a running engine.

Listen to CFD results more, flow benches and pattern makers less.

[Tuner]

Who recalls the distribution problems contestants encountered in the 2012 BLP Carb Shootout with single carbs on the tunnel ram type intake that had a long rectangular box plenum with parallel 90 deg. equally spaced runner entries, as opposed to the "X" layout of the Victor type intakes. The contestants supplied their own carb mounting plates that attached to the rectangular plenum with the carb situated in the center over the center four ports. The contestants using nearly flat lids had fuel distribution issues with the end cylinders lean and the center cylinders rich. The two contestants who used the same pyramid shaped lid had much better distribution and were the two top contestants in that portion of the shootout.

[Warp Speed]

When I think bout a NA engine, I don't think of the air as flowing into the carb then turning down into a runner. I think of it as a runner pulling the charge from the plenum, it pulls all around, top, bottom and some from even inside the runners next to it.

Non-vaporized fuel travels extremely slowly compared to air. So with that kind of manifold I think your center cylinders will get much more fuel than outer ones. X-type manifold is all about equal length flow path to each runner to keep fuel distribution in control.

I would have to agree with that but I'm no intake design expert by any means. I would expect the H design would need something like the Turtle used in X runner/plenum designs to direct flow more equally. Every turn a mixture charge has to make reduces the pressure signal filling the cylinder.

A "turtle" doesnt direct flow, but in theory directs fuel on the plenum floor..........and not very well! Lol
I have said this many times, I applaud his passion and enthusiasm. But I see way too many issues/challenges in both cylinder head and manifold design, to be successful. IMO
Nice castings BTW!

[F-BIRD'88]

How far away from the fore and rear plenum box walls should the end port openings be. Make those end walls longer. How much gap between the end port openings and plenum box wall to avoid the port entrance being "coupled" to the plenum wall? ½" ? 1"?...