Gasser Cam

[n2omike]

Hey Guys
A buddy of mine is building a lower budget 1964 Falcon Gasser. It has a stock block 306 and a Toploader (2.78 1st gear). It will only run 1/8 mile, and has a 5.67 gear in the back. Due to the stock block/stock rods (arp bolts) and factory Toploader, along with wanting a decent service life, he wants to hold the rpm to 7000... which will still allow him to go 103 mph... which is more than he needs for the 1/8 mile.

Stock block 306
11:1 compression
Weiand Tunnel Ram with two Holley 450's. (can switch to Parker Funnel Web if need be)
Chinese 200 cc heads that have had some port work and don't look bad.
Solid Flat Tappet Cam (to be determined)
1-3/4" Fenderwell headers

It's time for a camshaft! There will be no nitrous, and a 7000 rpm limit. Needs to be solid flat tappet.
In my mind, I'm thinking around 246I/250E @ 0.050" with a 106 lsa and around 0.600" lift with 1/7 rockers. Tight lash is good, so it doesn't beat up parts.

What do you guys think? Mr. Jones?

Thanks!

Here's a picture of it. He's got the grill in, letters, emblems etc done. He's cut/buffed it, so it's a lot shinier now. Drives a school bus for a living, but has done all the body work and laquer paint himself. Moved/shaped the rear wheelwells, installed solid front axle, etc. Going to be a fun car! Was JUNK before he started.

[CamKing]

Part# FM74365-76364-106
244/252 @.050"
.365"/.364" Lobe Lift
106 LSA

This would be the biggest I would go on duration.

[n2omike]

Part# FM74365-76364-106
244/252 @.050"
.365"/.364" Lobe Lift
106 LSA

This would be the biggest I would go on duration.

I was looking at Comp's 'Tight Lash' series and similar numbers, but would rather give you the business. Get with me at burchracing@gmail.com with some specifics and a price quote, and we'll see if we can make it happen... recommended spring pressures, etc. I'm assuming this is the 351W firing order?

Thanks!

[BigBlocksOnTop2]

Whatcha gonna do to get that toploader to shift for ya? A 15.7 first gear is very steep....

[n2omike]

Whatcha gonna do to get that toploader to shift for ya? A 15.7 first gear is very steep....

My mustang has a stock toploader. Shifts at 6800-7000 just fine. Can leave the throttle buried, and pull gears too... as long as you do it right.
I build my own toploaders, and don't have to do anything special... just adjust some side clearances if needed. Also chamfer oil holes, but no major modifications. That being said, you can tear stuff up if it's not driven/shifted right.

As for a steep overall 1st gear... It's just a 306. They need plenty of gear. That being said, 1st gear will go by pretty fast in that car. He'll have to be on his toes!

[n2omike]

Alright... Looking forward to getting this cam from Mr. Jones.
Recommended seat pressure is 130-140 lbs, and 350 lbs over the nose at 0.584" lift

Have a question on springs...
He has a new set of Comp 914 springs/steel retainers. These are advertised as:
Seat 165 lbs at 1.800"
Open 385 lbs at 1.200
Rate 367 lbs/in

The installed height for the springs on the head is 1.840" to 1.845" for a 150 lb installed pressure.
Adding +0.050" locks brings it to around 132 lbs on the seat and 346 lbs open. (right on target)

However, at max lift the spring is only at 1.300"... and it doesn't coil bind until 1.100".
I've read that springs should be pushed close to coil bind to avoid resonance (twang).
Engine needs to spin 7k rpm.
Will these springs work with this installation"

Thanks everyone! (or Mike) if you see this after business hours.

[rp930]

I would follow Mikes recommendation.

[n2omike]

I would follow Mikes recommendation.

Haven't gotten his recommendation yet, as it's after business hours. Figured I'd throw it out here, and he or some other qualified person my share their $0.02.

[MELWAY]

Over the years I have run many sets of Isky plus springs with flat tappets over 7000rpm. And a lot are miles from coil bind .150” or more. And I have never had any issues

My thoughts were maybe the limited velocity of the flat tappet design didn’t worry or upset the spring even when it’s set up a long way from coil bind

[bobalattie]

I’d say run the springs at installed height, don’t bother with the .050 locks, just use edm lifters and let it spin. More spring pressure (within reasonable limits has never been a bad thing) use good oil, Mike supplies quality parts so flattening a cam or having a lifter eat itself isnt an issue... Don’t give it a second thought.

I’ve run a lot of hydraulic flat tappet stuff at 140-160 on the seat at 380-400 open.. no problems, cams last 2 seasons of roundy round racing..

[n2omike]

I talked with Mike. He said there was about a 70% chance of installing the existing springs with the +0.050" locks, and having success... and with this budget bomber, that's probably what he would do... and he would probably be able to feel/hear if it wasn't working. BUT, this is going into an open headered Gasser without a seasoned dyno/cam guy at the helm... so we looked into other options. Being the nature of this engine, EDM lifters are probably not on the parts list, as he already has a new set of Comps that came with another WAY too huge of a cam that he previously purchased... so running springs at 165 isn't in the game plan.

I do have a set of used Comp 950 springs and steel retainers that should provide the correct tension at his 1.840"-1.845" installed and open height. I'm going to the machine shop today, and will have him test the pressure to make sure they are still 'good'.

I hate un-updated posts, so there's where we sit!

[Krooser]

Have Mike regrind that big cam to friendlier specs... he'll save $$$ too.

[Bob Hollinshead]

Very cool build! Digging that lacquer paint-I did a lot of that years ago. keep it waxed and indoors as much as possible!

[Walter R. Malik]

Hey Guys
A buddy of mine is building a lower budget 1964 Falcon Gasser. It has a stock block 306 and a Toploader (2.78 1st gear). It will only run 1/8 mile, and has a 5.67 gear in the back. Due to the stock block/stock rods (arp bolts) and factory Toploader, along with wanting a decent service life, he wants to hold the rpm to 7000... which will still allow him to go 103 mph... which is more than he needs for the 1/8 mile.

Stock block 306
11:1 compression
Weiand Tunnel Ram with two Holley 450's. (can switch to Parker Funnel Web if need be)
Chinese 200 cc heads that have had some port work and don't look bad.
Solid Flat Tappet Cam (to be determined)
1-3/4" Fenderwell headers

It's time for a camshaft! There will be no nitrous, and a 7000 rpm limit. Needs to be solid flat tappet.
In my mind, I'm thinking around 246I/250E @ 0.050" with a 106 lsa and around 0.600" lift with 1/7 rockers. Tight lash is good, so it doesn't beat up parts.

What do you guys think? Mr. Jones?

Thanks!

Here's a picture of it. He's got the grill in, letters, emblems etc done. He's cut/buffed it, so it's a lot shinier now. Drives a school bus for a living, but has done all the body work and laquer paint himself. Moved/shaped the rear wheelwells, installed solid front axle, etc. Going to be a fun car! Was JUNK before he started.

Personally, I think that would be to small for a "Race car" gasser with a 4 speed manual trans & tunnel ram.
I don't think you would need a lot of torque below 5,000 RPM so, 256/262@.050" with 108 separation with as much lift as your heads and springs will accept.

[1972ho]

I wonder what he did buy seeing how this was in December and if he got it running let us know?