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302 Ford manifold selection

General engine tech -- Drag Racing to Circle Track

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frnkeore
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Re: 302 Ford manifold selection

Post by frnkeore » Thu Jan 23, 2020 6:58 pm

Caprimaniac wrote:
Thu Jan 23, 2020 4:19 pm
Sorry, cannot help you. But there’s something I miss in this inlet manifold thread. Why haven’t someone stepped up yet and shouted: Put on a tunnel ram and be done with it.

But you’re set on a low rise manifold, I guess.
I'm not set on a single carb manifold, at all but, I've been steered to the ones I listed by several people. The other thing is, they don't make "modern" tunnel ram, for high flow heads, that I can find. My heads have 2.16 x 1.30 intake ports. The only tunnel rams that I know about for the 302's are the Holley Sniper and 300-275. the largest of those intake ports (300) are 2.00 x 1.19. Not to mention that used 302 tunnel rams, are getting like hen's teeth to find.

This engine will run in the 78-80K range and those single carb manifolds will work in that range and have ports more closely matched to my heads.

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Re: 302 Ford manifold selection

Post by n2omike » Thu Jan 23, 2020 11:32 pm


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Re: 302 Ford manifold selection

Post by frnkeore » Fri Jan 24, 2020 1:31 am

Mike, those are the ones that I spoke of, the Sniper has a port of 2.00 x 1.08 and the 300 series, even the 351W have 2.00 x 1.19. My ports are 2.16 x 1.3. The sniper only has 1/8" walls so, there isn't anything you can do about it. The 300 is cast but, w/o having it, in hand, I can't say it would have enough material, in the right places to get close. If it could be enlarged it would be a lot of work but, I do like the design. The other draw back is the cost of $626 for a unknown quantity.

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Re: 302 Ford manifold selection

Post by MadBill » Fri Jan 24, 2020 9:36 am

I'd like to see a shootout between the Sniper and the cast TR. The former has really short runners with no curvature to them and ugly angles between them and the ports plus probably no bell mouths at the plenum. It looks to me to be designed for the guy more interested in bragging rights: "Yeah, full race cam, two fours on a Sheet Metal intake..." than performance. #-o
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Re: 302 Ford manifold selection

Post by n2omike » Fri Jan 24, 2020 11:22 am

MadBill wrote:
Fri Jan 24, 2020 9:36 am
I'd like to see a shootout between the Sniper and the cast TR. The former has really short runners with no curvature to them and ugly angles between them and the ports plus probably no bell mouths at the plenum. It looks to me to be designed for the guy more interested in bragging rights: "Yeah, full race cam, two fours on a Sheet Metal intake..." than performance. #-o
I agree.

Both intakes use fairly straight runners. The cast looks nicer, but the runners are pretty much straight up and down to get decent length, but do not align with the angle of the ports. The sheetmetal looks cheap. It's runners align with the angle of the ports in the head, but this makes them very short. It has a nice sized plenum, but the ports themselves are too small to supply big rpm.

The old 302 Weiand tunnel ram had curved runners in order to achieve decent length. However, it was cast/designed in the era before aftermarket heads... When it came out, the existing 289 heads were tiny, and only had a 126 cc intake port volume. lol Would be nice if someone came out with a modern tunnel ram that had right runner length and capacity to feed today's aftermarket heads/strokers.

If someone would have come out with a GOOD 351W tunnel ram around 1990 or so when things started to get hot again... they would have sold a BUNCH by now.

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Re: 302 Ford manifold selection

Post by treyrags » Fri Jan 24, 2020 11:33 am

frnkeore wrote:
Fri Jan 24, 2020 1:31 am
Mike, those are the ones that I spoke of, the Sniper has a port of 2.00 x 1.08 and the 300 series, even the 351W have 2.00 x 1.19. My ports are 2.16 x 1.3. The sniper only has 1/8" walls so, there isn't anything you can do about it. The 300 is cast but, w/o having it, in hand, I can't say it would have enough material, in the right places to get close. If it could be enlarged it would be a lot of work but, I do like the design. The other draw back is the cost of $626 for a unknown quantity.
Most cast intakes are intentionally left smaller with extra meat at the exit to allow matching and blending. I would think someone at Holley could tell you if this is the case.

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Re: 302 Ford manifold selection

Post by EDC » Fri Jan 24, 2020 11:51 am

Image
Image
Image
Image
"Quality" is like buying oats. You can pay a fair price for it and get some good quality oats,
or you can get it a hell of a lot cheaper, when it's already been through the horse.

Nil Satis Nisi Optimum

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Re: 302 Ford manifold selection

Post by treyrags » Fri Jan 24, 2020 1:23 pm

Thanks Ed. Almost 5 sq in on top (less radius) and meat on the bottom. Look plenty big to me.

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Re: 302 Ford manifold selection

Post by frnkeore » Fri Jan 24, 2020 5:37 pm

Ed, thank you, very much for those pics.

Can you tell us what the ported dimensions are?

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Re: 302 Ford manifold selection

Post by powerhouse » Fri Jan 31, 2020 8:37 am

I tested a super vic vs. A knock off funnel web on a 306 about a year ago. Fw had the runner exits opened up to match the heads and some blending in the plenum. Super vic just some blending in plenum as the exits already were the correct size. Engine makes peak power around 7600. The FW was up about 10 lb. Ft. At 6500 range over the super vic but was down 10 hp at peak. Power also fell off faster with the FW. Super vic made 512 hp at 7600 and was still over 500 at 8000.
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Re: 302 Ford manifold selection

Post by MadBill » Fri Jan 31, 2020 9:33 am

What were the torque peaks and revs?
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Re: 302 Ford manifold selection

Post by powerhouse » Fri Jan 31, 2020 11:06 am

MadBill wrote:
Fri Jan 31, 2020 9:33 am
What were the torque peaks and revs?
Peak tq around 6-6100... pulled engine to 8200
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Re: 302 Ford manifold selection

Post by raynorshine » Fri Jan 31, 2020 12:11 pm

never was a Ford fanatic, but i remember an aluminum single plane manifold for a SBF that looked horrible, very straight runners..etc.."torker" i think :roll:
Use it up
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Re: 302 Ford manifold selection

Post by EDC » Fri Jan 31, 2020 12:27 pm

Image
Image

Came out pretty nice.

Port matched to the AFR 205 heads.

To add to Bill's info...

Overall height: 6-1/8"
Plenum Depth: 3-3/4"
"Quality" is like buying oats. You can pay a fair price for it and get some good quality oats,
or you can get it a hell of a lot cheaper, when it's already been through the horse.

Nil Satis Nisi Optimum

Ed Curtis - www.FlowTechInduction.com

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Re: 302 Ford manifold selection

Post by MadBill » Fri Jan 31, 2020 12:46 pm

raynorshine wrote:
Fri Jan 31, 2020 12:11 pm
never was a Ford fanatic, but i remember an aluminum single plane manifold for a SBF that looked horrible, very straight runners..etc.."torker" i think :roll:
There were SBC and BBC versions of the Torker too. I remember a contemporary Hot Rod article quoting Vic Edelbrock extolling its virtues and cautioning buyers not to open up the horribly undersized mis-angled and mispositioned runner openings.

Here's what our guy PackardV8 had to say twelve years back on another forum:

"Short answer - one of the worst street manifolds Edelbrock ever sold. Do the hot rod universe a favor and sell it for scrap before it gets into the wrong hands.

(And yes, I was there when it was introduced and believed the whores at Hot Rod Magazine who swore it was the way to go!! Wasted some of the best years of my young life trying to make it work.)"

jack vines
PACKARDV8, AUG 17, 2018SHARE POST#5

I too drank the Koolaid and bought one in 1978 for the 495" BBC I was swapping into my '70 -1/2 Camaro. I never tried another manifold on my now long-dormant Z, so I had nothing to compare it with but I might cycle it across the pump along with a couple of others when I dyno it, hopefully this summer, just to see how badly I'd hand-cuffed my project.
Felix, qui potuit rerum cognscere causas.

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