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Edelbrock E force heads #5089
Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2020 11:23 am
by gordon
Got a set of these heads with the intent to put them on a hyd FT cammed 383 sbc for a truck (58GMC) . First three blocks I had cleaned and checked were cracked, latest one is a 1989 roller block . Waiting to hear back from shop as to pass or fail for use. If it is a go then I would like to use a mild hyd roller cam since block is a roller style block. Since Edelbrock says not for roller use ,what would it take to make these heads work with mild hyd roller cam , parts and labor $$$? If necessary I will ditch these and get some more expensive heads already set up for the Hyd roller combo. Looking at the TFS aluminum heads that look like the old double hump units. Flow numbers looked good for small runner heads. Idle to 5500 max. not a rumpty rump set up. I think TFS 3021007 or 3021006 I was told these are USA castings.
Re: Edelbrock E force heads #5089
Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2020 11:45 am
by af2
Put some good springs on them and run the hydro roller.
They are a decent head for what you are doing.
If you run out of options on a block, I have a few good ones.
Re: Edelbrock E force heads #5089
Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2020 12:17 pm
by mag2555
X2!
Change out the springs for a good set of Manlys and for sure then confirm your coil bind clearance and retainer to seal clearance both for the lift your choosen Cam has and shoot for 140 psi on the seat.
Re: Edelbrock E force heads #5089
Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2020 12:47 pm
by 65dragster
So, I have a set of these E Force heads (came on a motor I bought) but they are earlier version with Edelbrock #6088 casting number. My understanding is that Edelbrock sells the castings to EPWI and they sell to machine shops complete or as a bare casting. Mine are complete, supposedly with a hydraulic roller spring good to .570 lift. Rex Hutchinson machine shop did a light pocket port job and did cartridge roll work to clean up the intake ports. I haven't had the heads flowed, but they look like a decent street head. Does anybody have experience with these?
Re: Edelbrock E force heads #5089
Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2020 12:53 pm
by Alaskaracer
Agreed, proper springs for the cam you choose and you're good.
Re: Edelbrock E force heads #5089
Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2020 1:18 pm
by rebelyell
gordon wrote: ↑Fri Jun 19, 2020 11:23 am
Got a set of these heads with the intent to put them on a hyd FT cammed 383 sbc for a truck (58GMC) . First three blocks I had cleaned and checked were cracked, latest one is a 1989 roller block . Waiting to hear back from shop as to pass or fail for use. If it is a go then I would like to use a mild hyd roller cam since block is a roller style block. Since Edelbrock says not for roller use ,what would it take to make these heads work with mild hyd roller cam , parts and labor $$$? If necessary I will ditch these and get some more expensive heads already set up for the Hyd roller combo. Looking at the TFS aluminum heads that look like the old double hump units. Flow numbers looked good for small runner heads. Idle to 5500 max. not a rumpty rump set up. I think TFS 3021007 or 3021006 I was told these are USA castings.
Compare:
chevy performance 350/357 has iron vortec heads with 10212811 spring; a plain jane vortec single w/ 80 lbs on seat
along with 12677151 hyd ROLLER cam 215*/223* .473"/.473".
That spring is only ~ 80 lb on seat & ~ 256 lb open
have little doubt your edelbrock springs are as strong if not stronger. GM engineers know more about this than I do.
https://paceperformance.com/i-6484546-1 ... ingle.html
https://www.chevrolet.com/content/dam/c ... 367080.pdf
BTW, the OE Roller Lifters are considerably lighter than typical link-bar retro-rollers lifters; lighter requires less spring to control its mass.
Re: Edelbrock E force heads #5089
Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2020 1:30 pm
by gordon
My big concern was their (Edelbrock) comment to me that I would experience seat failure due to closing rate of valves being more aggressive even on the milder hyd roller cams.
Re: Edelbrock E force heads #5089
Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2020 1:39 pm
by rebelyell
gordon wrote: ↑Fri Jun 19, 2020 1:30 pm
My big concern was their (Edelbrock) comment to me that I would experience seat failure due to closing rate of valves being more aggressive even on the milder hyd roller cams.
Perhaps GM engineers forgot all about that.
Re: Edelbrock E force heads #5089
Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2020 1:39 pm
by rebelyell
double post
Re: Edelbrock E force heads #5089
Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2020 5:19 pm
by gordon
Info in box with heads : spring dia. 1.460"
Installed @ 1.800"
seat pressure 125 lbs.
@ .500" lift 320 lbs.
Max rec. lift .550"
Then in several places on info sheet says Not compatible with Hyd. roller cams.
Tech at Edelbrock on phone said powdered seats used in head will not take the impact loads of Hyd. roller cams. today. So I am curious as to price of putting better seats in these heads and maybe better springs and valves.
Re: Edelbrock E force heads #5089
Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2020 5:22 pm
by af2
gordon wrote: ↑Fri Jun 19, 2020 5:19 pm
Info in box with heads : spring dia. 1.460"
Installed @ 1.800"
seat pressure 125 lbs.
@ .500" lift 320 lbs.
Max rec. lift .550"
Then in several places on info sheet says Not compatible with Hyd. roller cams.
Tech at Edelbrock on phone said powdered seats used in head will not take the impact loads of Hyd. roller cams. today. So I am curious as to price of putting better seats in these heads and maybe better springs and valves.
Wrong!!!
Re: Edelbrock E force heads #5089
Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2020 5:40 pm
by rebelyell
Tech is wrong when he told you a weaker spring would cause valves' closing rate to be more aggressive. Incredible! Tech either flunked freshman physics (hooke's law - young's modulus) or has No practical valvetrain experience -- or both. Really?? It's the stronger spring that both accelerates valve toward seat at faster rate and slams it shut that much harder; Not the weaker spring. Next thing tech's gonna tell ya: he's Vic himself.
Differences in those e-street heads are the different springs' strengths (psi etc); not their seats
Re: Edelbrock E force heads #5089
Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2020 10:39 pm
by MadBill
Unless the valvetrain loses control*, is it not the
lobe profile (and RPM) that determines the contact velocity? (*And of course a too weak spring is a major cause of same.)
Re: Edelbrock E force heads #5089
Posted: Sat Jun 20, 2020 12:42 am
by F-BIRD'88
There are lots of hyd rollers that will work with those springs.
Re: Edelbrock E force heads #5089
Posted: Sat Jun 20, 2020 3:25 pm
by 1980RS
gordon wrote: ↑Fri Jun 19, 2020 5:19 pm
Info in box with heads : spring dia. 1.460"
Installed @ 1.800"
seat pressure 125 lbs.
@ .500" lift 320 lbs.
Max rec. lift .550"
Then in several places on info sheet says Not compatible with Hyd. roller cams.
Tech at Edelbrock on phone said powdered seats used in head will not take the impact loads of Hyd. roller cams. today. So I am curious as to price of putting better seats in these heads and maybe better springs and valves.
Talking with an Edelbrock Tech on stuff is like talking to a brick wall. You will get a better answer from the wall. When I got a badly machined intake form them a few years ago it was like trying to pull teeth to find someone there who had any type of mechanical aptitude. Unbelievable with a company like Edelbrock.