Engine Race Oil

[midnightbluS10]

What's the actual application?
What's the rod and main bearing clearances?
What's your max oil temp?
What's your oil capacity?
What country are you in?

The ideal oil is different for every application. You wouldn't want to put an oil with a low pressure-viscosity coefficient in a high boost or nitrous engine, for example.

Renault F1 cars may advertise Castrol Edge, but what they actually use is far from the Castrol Edge you can just buy off the shelf at Autozone.

Without some more information on the engine and its use, any recommendation would be like playing chess in the dark.

Engine is a Audi V10 from the RS6 2009 car , Twin turbo making 570HP at 6500 rpm originally. Now makes well over 800HP at 7000 rpm. The car will be used for circuit and road racing.
Mains 0.0028"
Rods 0.002"
Engine is dry sump and holds 10L of oil . Oil temps of just over 100 deg C
I am in Australia


Ray.

I'm not sure the race teams you listed earlier are using off the shelf "racing oil" like standard Castrol Edge or Mobil 1 like you'd find on the shelf at your local distributor/auto parts store. If they are, that's news to me.

[swampbuggy]

The Mobil 1 oils that are produced for extreme racing conditions are a different part number and cost about twice the amount of every day Mobil 1, Mark H.

[econo racer]

I like Valvoline VR1.

[David Redszus]

For which part of the engine are you trying to select an oil?
Rings?
Bearings?
Cam bearings?
Cam lobes?
Valves stems?
Timing chains or gears?

Motor oils can have properties that will address these lubrication areas, but not optimally for each area.
Which areas must be addressed and which can be ignored may depend upon a specific engine design.

The best oil may be one that is the best compromise for the critical lubrication areas.

[Racerrick]

If you got the cash and the clout, the mobil1 race oil division will custom blend your oil and that is what the top teams do.

[swampbuggy]

The above post ^^^^^^^^is a Fact, other oil Companies do this as well, Valvoline for sure. Mark H.

[hoffman900]

I am still wondering what we’re trying to solve. Are the OEM specs not adequate?

[David Redszus]

I am still wondering what we’re trying to solve. Are the OEM specs not adequate?

There are many excellent oils available in the marketplace.
If you ignore brand names and only refer to oil and engine specifications.
The problem is one of proper selection for the specific application.

If you don't know what the engine needs...how will you know what to feed it?

[1972ho]

When people talk about buying oils for extreme racing conditions,What is extreme racing conditions do you mean a stock eliminator 350 chevy making 500 hp and turning 7500 rpm are a 600 Hp big block Chevy 500 cid turning 7000 rpm bracket racing 3 times a month are a comp eliminator small block 280 cid making 600 hp and turning 10000 rpm which ones can run a off the shelf oil of proper viscosity are will they all need a racing type oil.

[David Redszus]

Following is a list of information a lubrication engineer would require in
order to specify a motor oil. There are several more but I can't remember them all.
These are just for the engine bearings; not rings, cams, chains, etc.

Journal diameter
Bearing clearance
Bearing length
Bearing load
Bearing speed
Oil temperature
Oil viscosity @ 40oC
Oil viscosity @ 100oC
Oil specific gravity
Oil pressure
Bearing area
Bearing unit pressure
Bearing flow area

[MELWAY]

I am still wondering what we’re trying to solve. Are the OEM specs not adequate?

There are many excellent oils available in the marketplace.
If you ignore brand names and only refer to oil and engine specifications.
The problem is one of proper selection for the specific application.

If you don't know what the engine needs...how will you know what to feed it?

David
What are your thoughts and experience on pennsilvania base synthetic blend oils?
In the last few years of tear down and freshen ups they look to protect all wear surfaces better than so called high end synthetic oils

[steve cowan]

I am still wondering what we’re trying to solve. Are the OEM specs not adequate?

There are many excellent oils available in the marketplace.
If you ignore brand names and only refer to oil and engine specifications.
The problem is one of proper selection for the specific application.

If you don't know what the engine needs...how will you know what to feed it?

David
What are your thoughts and experience on pennsilvania base synthetic blend oils?
In the last few years of tear down and freshen ups they look to protect all wear surfaces better than so called high end synthetic oils

James,
What oil you using on your dyno tested engines, I won't be far off having my Dart block 383 finished that will see dyno time.
I am using BR 30 initially not sure what to use on this engine,cost is not a big deal.
Any recommendations

[JC565Ford]

I have someone suggest I use a good "Race Oil " in my engine which is a Audi V10 turbocharged to 800 HP at 7000 rpm.

I have always run in my "race engines" Either Mobil 1 or Castrol Edge. This was in dinosaur BBC engines making 1600HP and raced at WOT for 30 minutes to and hour. Bearings were always perfect after a season of racing. Other engines built by other people often failed using do called Race Oils
I see Castrol Edge is used in the Renault Formula one engines other team use Mobil 1. No doubt these are race engines.
So my question should these oils be thrown out and replaced by so called Race Oils, and what should I use in this very moden engine.

Ray.

30 minutes at WOT ? Is this a jet boat river racer ? Edit: I saw your other post about the Audi V-10

What range of oil temps are you seeing, and I'll assume you have a hell of a heat exchanger ?


Oh yeah, If it isn't broken they don't fix it.

The M1 Racing oil is very good as is Redline or Motul.

Redline 15-40 might be an option ...listed at $15 qrt.

[RDY4WAR]

There's a lot of variables at play to picking the "ideal" engine oil. David listed off several of them pertaining only to the bearings.

Thinner and lower tension rings like lower viscosity.
Short travel hydraulic lifters like lower viscosity.
Methanol fueled engines want little to no detergents.
Nitrous engines will want a high pressure-viscosity coefficient.
Endurance engines will want high thermal stability and shear stability.
An engine/car stored through the winter months will want a lot of anti-corrosion and metal inhibitors.
Daily driver will want more detergents and anti-oxidants.
Solid roller cams, with high spring pressures, will want more extreme pressure additives.
High rpm likes high shear stability, more anti-aeration, and more friction modifiers. (and often lower viscosity)

I suggested Penrite 10 Tenths 15w-50 to him because of his sustained WOT use with boost which will want a very thermal and shear stable oil. The PAO and ester formula provides that and is pretty easy to find in Australia. If he was drag racing it, my recommendation would be very different. If it was daily driven, it would be different. If it was on methanol, it would be different.

[MELWAY]

There are many excellent oils available in the marketplace.
If you ignore brand names and only refer to oil and engine specifications.
The problem is one of proper selection for the specific application.

If you don't know what the engine needs...how will you know what to feed it?

David
What are your thoughts and experience on pennsilvania base synthetic blend oils?
In the last few years of tear down and freshen ups they look to protect all wear surfaces better than so called high end synthetic oils

James,
What oil you using on your dyno tested engines, I won't be far off having my Dart block 383 finished that will see dyno time.
I am using BR 30 initially not sure what to use on this engine,cost is not a big deal.
Any recommendations

The best I have seen engine parts look on tear down is the old bradpenn or Torco tr1. I have recently been using a lot of driven GP1. But haven’t seen an engine tear down form years of running yet but feel it will be a great oil