It's all about the FUEL

[fabr]

Following are data for acetone, ethanol and a 15/85 blend.


.....Acetone...Ethanol..Blend15/85
MON ....90........90........90
RON ...110......109.......109.2
O2.......27.5.....34.6.....33.5
BP........133......174......167.9
RVP......4.35......1.8........2.18
Hvap ...127.......370.......334
Hcomb.12298....11493.....11614
Stoich...9.51.....8.99.......9.07
SpG......0.79.....0.794.....0.793
Power....1293.....1278......1281
Enrich....7.5.......7.1......7.2

The only areas that show a significant change due to the addition of 15% acetone
are the reduction in boiling point and the reduction in fuel evaporative charge cooling.

Acetone is expensive and provides very little benefit. Other fuel components could be
used to provide greater performance improvement.

I buy E98 by the drum and blend with 87 no alky unleaded to get E85 for the consistency vs pump E85. What would be good to blend as part or all of the 15% to improve cold weather/cold engine starting beyond what the unleaded does ? Say 30 degree air temps as the minimum.

[David Redszus]

Following are data for acetone, ethanol and a 15/85 blend.


.....Acetone...Ethanol..Blend15/85
MON ....90........90........90
RON ...110......109.......109.2
O2.......27.5.....34.6.....33.5
BP........133......174......167.9
RVP......4.35......1.8........2.18
Hvap ...127.......370.......334
Hcomb.12298....11493.....11614
Stoich...9.51.....8.99.......9.07
SpG......0.79.....0.794.....0.793
Power....1293.....1278......1281
Enrich....7.5.......7.1......7.2

The only areas that show a significant change due to the addition of 15% acetone
are the reduction in boiling point and the reduction in fuel evaporative charge cooling.

Acetone is expensive and provides very little benefit. Other fuel components could be
used to provide greater performance improvement.

I buy E98 by the drum and blend with 87 no alky unleaded to get E85 for the consistency vs pump E85. What would be good to blend as part or all of the 15% to improve cold weather/cold engine starting beyond what the unleaded does ? Say 30 degree air temps as the minimum.

The good news is, we can simply replace the data indicated for acetone with data reflecting 87 pump gas.
The bad news is, we must replace the data indicated for acetone with data for 87 pump gas; which we do not have.

The reason we lack data for 87 pump is because there are so many different pump fuels with an octane index of 87.
That provides us with no useful information regarding the specific 87 blend you have.

The solution is to purchase your favorite 87 junk gas by the drum, and send a sample to a lab for analysis.

One would be much better served by purchasing a low boiling point race gas as a blending agent; at least we would
have some idea of the fuel properties. Among possible blending candidates are: VP C45, C50, CHP+.

[fabr]

I assumed that was the case. Thank you very much for the reply. Of the VP candidates,which one would you suggest as the best pick for the 30 degrees air temperature scenario and would you suggest a different one for say 50 degree air temps for cold engine starting?

[RDY4WAR]

What about E85 that's just 85% ethanol and 15% 224TMP?

[David Redszus]

What about E85 that's just 85% ethanol and 15% 224TMP?

2,2,4 trimethylpentane, often called isooctane, would be a poor choice as an additive due to its
relatively high boiling point (211F) and low vapor pressure (0.79 psi).

Any of the VP blends shown previously would be suitable blending candidates.

[gruntguru]

This engine is rather air limited. Stock heads, valves, intake, and cam. Heads flow ~205/145 and cam is just 202/207 @ .050". It needs all the help it can get.

I hadn't considered blending nitromethane with E85. That would be interesting. In either case, would 5-10% nitromethane make any substantial difference worth the hassle of handling the mess?

5-10% will not do much but will do something, it might smell nice. Over 40-50% should start pushing parts around.

Like most things that increase power, nitro has diminishing returns. Small amounts actually make a big difference when done properly. In this paper (I know its a two stroke!) 5% Nitro made 12% more power and 10% nitro made 21%.

[David Redszus]

In these days in my area fuel is too expensive for vehicles. Is there any cheap alternative to gasoline fossil fuel.

A bicycle.

Gasoline is perhaps the most efficient of all fuels for transportation due to its high energy density.

The cost of gasoline can be reduced substantially by improvements in discovery, recovery, refining and
distribution. The opposing factor is politics.

[Dave Koehler]

In these days in my area fuel is too expensive for vehicles. Is there any cheap alternative to gasoline fossil fuel.

A bicycle.

Gasoline is perhaps the most efficient of all fuels for transportation due to its high energy density.

The cost of gasoline can be reduced substantially by improvements in discovery, recovery, refining and
distribution. The opposing factor is politics.

I think he already knew the answer and the question is to promote his electric bike review website.

[gruntguru]

n these days in my area fuel is too expensive for vehicles. Is there any cheap alternative to gasoline fossil fuel.

Nitromethane is not the answer!

Hydrogen has a much higher energy content than any fossil fuel.
It also lends itself to using a fuel cell rather than a combustion engine (fuel cells have more than double the conversion efficiency of ICEs).
It also lends itself to regen braking. FCEVs already have the electric motor - just need to add a small battery or ultra-capacitor.

Toyoat's Mirai (mid-size sedan) carries 5kg (11 lb) of Hydrogen fuel and has a range of 650km (400 mi). The fuel tank weighs 80kg and occupies 120 litres of volume.

[RAS]

The Fuel is the energy source. Hard Stop. I bet a full run fuel flow meter chart would scream data on a fuel car. Everything used to increase the amount of fuel burned is a power adder. Turbos, Superchargers, Screw blowers, Nitrous, all help to burn more fuel. Fuel cars used to have a 13-gallon pump back in the 70s and they burned up regularly. Super lean. Even if they had a 35-gallon pump it wouldn't have helped because there was no Magneto or plugs to fire it. Fuel cars today run at almost hydraulic lock. With an air fuel of 1 to 1 you can do that. Pushing out gaskets and lifting heads is the safety valve. There is one guy who should have written a book on this. SID WATERMAN

[RDY4WAR]

I just want to try it to say I did it. Blend nitromethane with E85, just 5% or so.

I've wondered about blending VP 60% Nitro boat fuel at a small ratio with E85 just to see what it would do. Tune for both E85 and E85 + 5% nitromethane to see if there's any advantage there.

I'm also considering blending in a light ester like trimethylolpropane at like 100:1.

I just geek out on the chemistry and reactions.

[jacksoni]

This engine is rather air limited. Stock heads, valves, intake, and cam. Heads flow ~205/145 and cam is just 202/207 @ .050". It needs all the help it can get.

I hadn't considered blending nitromethane with E85. That would be interesting. In either case, would 5-10% nitromethane make any substantial difference worth the hassle of handling the mess?

5-10% will not do much but will do something, it might smell nice. Over 40-50% should start pushing parts around.

Like most things that increase power, nitro has diminishing returns. Small amounts actually make a big difference when done properly. In this paper (I know its a two stroke!) 5% Nitro made 12% more power and 10% nitro made 21%.

What paper are you quoting?

[gruntguru]

5-10% will not do much but will do something, it might smell nice. Over 40-50% should start pushing parts around.

Like most things that increase power, nitro has diminishing returns. Small amounts actually make a big difference when done properly. In this paper (I know its a two stroke!) 5% Nitro made 12% more power and 10% nitro made 21%.

What paper are you quoting?

Sorry - missing link.
https://www.researchgate.net/publicatio ... ton_Engine

https://qut.primo.exlibrisgroup.com/dis ... e&offset=0

[RAS]

E85 has a high oxygen content. There's power there. Nitro is a volume fuel. To mix Nitro with anything else is counterproductive. It's NOT about percentage. That's the stock market! In the 70's a Pontiac ran 20%, a Chevrolet ran 86% and the Hemi ran the full can. Keep in mind these were factory cast iron blocks. Today, there's an injector in the hat, 2 in the intake manifold and 2 down nozzles in the head. That's 5 injectors at full song! Volume. Less percentage though. NHRA cut it to 85% but, they go faster than ever. Bigger pump!
What drives me nuts is that intake valve. You have the right cam, intake, power adder, etc. and then that valve blocks everything! There is no such thing as an intake manifold that has equal distribution. What happens in that intake is a constant variable. A/F ratios are all over the place constantly. It's a hurricane in there. I modified a Smokey Ram Manifold once with Smokey's instructions that I still have and value very much, and it was a real learning experience. Huge volume that has to go extremely rich real fast. NOT for the street. Fun times.

[RAS]

Race engine builders will tell you that lowering compression and adding more fuel volume is the current trend. Especially with a power adder.