Dyno tuned 434 SBC 11:1 AFR 245 Solid Roller

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steve cowan
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Re: Dyno tuned 434 SBC 11:1 AFR 245 Solid Roller

Post by steve cowan »

I think once a street type car starts running over 135 mph google theory goes out the window.
Same for a engine that makes good hp/ cube alot of things we think we know are dead wrong.
Scott has basically added 200 hp or so to the car and it a new ball game in my opinion, unless you have decades of experience at that level it can be daunting and talking to people that actually know is a small group usually.
From my experience track tuning is tough, there are so many variables and a lot of hurry up and wait scenarios lol
Think about how many hrs we have waited in staging lanes of years / decades
I can see how guys do engine dyno then hub dyno then race track in that order.
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Re: Dyno tuned 434 SBC 11:1 AFR 245 Solid Roller

Post by 1980RS »

steve cowan wrote: Sun May 22, 2022 4:40 pm I think once a street type car starts running over 135 mph google theory goes out the window.
Same for a engine that makes good hp/ cube alot of things we think we know are dead wrong.
Scott has basically added 200 hp or so to the car and it a new ball game in my opinion, unless you have decades of experience at that level it can be daunting and talking to people that actually know is a small group usually.
From my experience track tuning is tough, there are so many variables and a lot of hurry up and wait scenarios lol
Think about how many hrs we have waited in staging lanes of years / decades
I can see how guys do engine dyno then hub dyno then race track in that order.
You hit the nail on the head Steve. Just like my friend with his peanut port 468 that made 571hp with a boat load of tq. but that engine was only good for a low 11 sec time. He is a dyno racer and gets to the track and his sheet does not perform to expectations. I have no doubt Scott will get his Camaro in the 9's. Best thing is he gets to race at a sea level track.
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Re: Dyno tuned 434 SBC 11:1 AFR 245 Solid Roller

Post by ChopperScott »

When I first took the 355 to the track, many years ago, I was very disappointed. It was running low-mid 12's. I thought it was an 11 second car. The combo was completely wrong. Over time I kept making changes until it was running low-mid 11's. I spent way more time bracket racing, than test and tuning. It probably could have gone faster. This time, after many lessons learned, I set a goal and tried to build the car to meet it. 10.00's @ 135. I'm not that far off. As mentioned before, the math is correct. The car is not performing to expectations according to the numbers. I wasn't sure if detuning would be necessary to keep the car slower than 10 seconds. That's not the case. There are still a lot of factors to work with... suspension, launch rpm, shift rpm, bigger carb, smaller tire, timing (w/race fuel), etc. I don't do a lot of a-b testing. I mostly bracket race at nostalgia events when I go to the tracks. When I make changes, it's before competition day and then run the car as is.
'73 Camaro Z/28 NETO/N
434 SBC 11:1, 1.294, 6.178 @ 108.87, 9.81 @ 134.93 (3060#, Naturally Aspirated, Sunoco Ultra 94)
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Re: Dyno tuned 434 SBC 11:1 AFR 245 Solid Roller

Post by prairiehotrodder »

I'm helping a friend with a 423 SBC in a 78 lemans and its difficult to run the numbers that the math wants. When your parts say you should have X horsepower yet your track times say you have 100 hp less it gets frustrating.
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Re: Dyno tuned 434 SBC 11:1 AFR 245 Solid Roller

Post by 1980RS »

ChopperScott wrote: Mon May 23, 2022 11:13 am When I first took the 355 to the track, many years ago, I was very disappointed. It was running low-mid 12's. I thought it was an 11 second car. The combo was completely wrong. Over time I kept making changes until it was running low-mid 11's. I spent way more time bracket racing, than test and tuning. It probably could have gone faster. This time, after many lessons learned, I set a goal and tried to build the car to meet it. 10.00's @ 135. I'm not that far off. As mentioned before, the math is correct. The car is not performing to expectations according to the numbers. I wasn't sure if detuning would be necessary to keep the car slower than 10 seconds. That's not the case. There are still a lot of factors to work with... suspension, launch rpm, shift rpm, bigger carb, smaller tire, timing (w/race fuel), etc. I don't do a lot of a-b testing. I mostly bracket race at nostalgia events when I go to the tracks. When I make changes, it's before competition day and then run the car as is.
Ya sometimes combos sure teach you a lesson or two don't they. Last fall with my 358 SBC .040 pump gas with a set of Iron head Sportsman II's and a ported Air Gap on the car. Guys were telling me that intake will kill that combo on the top end. Well I got the last laugh and with my new 850 FST vs carb in testing I ran an 11.30 flat at over 117mph. During eliminations in the semis I red lit by .009 but that's ok as the same car I was running we battled it out with my 11.38 out running his 11.46, now here's the good news, he runs a 383 with AFR CNC ported heads and he did walk over to see my car. He was stunned when I told him it runs on pump gas and is a 3.48 stroke engine. I gave him props for the win but he was more pissed that I out ran him. I want to see your 434 in the 9's and I have one more block I can make a 434 with. 2K for the kit and I only have AFR 210 CNC heads but for me they'll have to do, lol.
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Re: Dyno tuned 434 SBC 11:1 AFR 245 Solid Roller

Post by steve cowan »

1980RS wrote: Mon May 23, 2022 9:54 pm
ChopperScott wrote: Mon May 23, 2022 11:13 am When I first took the 355 to the track, many years ago, I was very disappointed. It was running low-mid 12's. I thought it was an 11 second car. The combo was completely wrong. Over time I kept making changes until it was running low-mid 11's. I spent way more time bracket racing, than test and tuning. It probably could have gone faster. This time, after many lessons learned, I set a goal and tried to build the car to meet it. 10.00's @ 135. I'm not that far off. As mentioned before, the math is correct. The car is not performing to expectations according to the numbers. I wasn't sure if detuning would be necessary to keep the car slower than 10 seconds. That's not the case. There are still a lot of factors to work with... suspension, launch rpm, shift rpm, bigger carb, smaller tire, timing (w/race fuel), etc. I don't do a lot of a-b testing. I mostly bracket race at nostalgia events when I go to the tracks. When I make changes, it's before competition day and then run the car as is.
Ya sometimes combos sure teach you a lesson or two don't they. Last fall with my 358 SBC .040 pump gas with a set of Iron head Sportsman II's and a ported Air Gap on the car. Guys were telling me that intake will kill that combo on the top end. Well I got the last laugh and with my new 850 FST vs carb in testing I ran an 11.30 flat at over 117mph. During eliminations in the semis I red lit by .009 but that's ok as the same car I was running we battled it out with my 11.38 out running his 11.46, now here's the good news, he runs a 383 with AFR CNC ported heads and he did walk over to see my car. He was stunned when I told him it runs on pump gas and is a 3.48 stroke engine. I gave him props for the win but he was more pissed that I out ran him. I want to see your 434 in the 9's and I have one more block I can make a 434 with. 2K for the kit and I only have AFR 210 CNC heads but for me they'll have to do, lol.
Your car and mine weigh the same,I am impressed with your 358 with SP2 close to 500hp.
I still have a unported set of SP 2
I have done some 50 degree seat testing and raised one port and filled floor,and I it flowed 290 @ 204cc ,it responded well,the exhaust took some work from what I remember.
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Re: Dyno tuned 434 SBC 11:1 AFR 245 Solid Roller

Post by steve cowan »

ChopperScott wrote: Mon May 23, 2022 11:13 am When I first took the 355 to the track, many years ago, I was very disappointed. It was running low-mid 12's. I thought it was an 11 second car. The combo was completely wrong. Over time I kept making changes until it was running low-mid 11's. I spent way more time bracket racing, than test and tuning. It probably could have gone faster. This time, after many lessons learned, I set a goal and tried to build the car to meet it. 10.00's @ 135. I'm not that far off. As mentioned before, the math is correct. The car is not performing to expectations according to the numbers. I wasn't sure if detuning would be necessary to keep the car slower than 10 seconds. That's not the case. There are still a lot of factors to work with... suspension, launch rpm, shift rpm, bigger carb, smaller tire, timing (w/race fuel), etc. I don't do a lot of a-b testing. I mostly bracket race at nostalgia events when I go to the tracks. When I make changes, it's before competition day and then run the car as is.
You will run 10.0,s
Then it won't be fast enough lol
9.50s then 9.0s etc etc
I had a 32 ford roaster back in 2000 - 2008.
It was registered car
BBC and glide.well build car and teched to run fast.
Car weight 3100 with me.
I got it to run consistently 9.90 @ 135 mph.
Of course I wanted to go faster but couldn't afford a decent engine.
I had used nitrous in a few streeters and a good friend of mine is a die hard nitrous guy.
So I am running tunnel ram fit 2 x plate systems, do the math for jets because of 2 plates.
Only want to spray 100 shot first up.
First pass goes 9.2 @ 143 and I pull chute first time at that speed and near on crap myself, can't believe the speed sensation, I figured it would not be a big deal.
Lol and I on a 10.5 tyre as well.
Anyway over 3-4 years and lots of passes,a couple of broken powerglides leaving off the brake at 5500,motor freshen up etc
Single stage 300 shot
8.90 at 150mph.
She was a sweet ride,just wanted to share that.
Scott,you will want to run faster trust me :D
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Re: Dyno tuned 434 SBC 11:1 AFR 245 Solid Roller

Post by ChopperScott »

I’m not a fan of running without an air filter, but I’m tossing the idea of a lexan scoop around in my head…
039CD2EA-6315-4CFF-B48A-A1E10FAD9E6F.jpeg
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'73 Camaro Z/28 NETO/N
434 SBC 11:1, 1.294, 6.178 @ 108.87, 9.81 @ 134.93 (3060#, Naturally Aspirated, Sunoco Ultra 94)
Chopper Air Port 917-589-1278
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Re: Dyno tuned 434 SBC 11:1 AFR 245 Solid Roller

Post by steve cowan »

ChopperScott wrote: Fri May 27, 2022 8:25 pm I’m not a fan of running without an air filter, but I’m tossing the idea of a lexan scoop around in my head…

039CD2EA-6315-4CFF-B48A-A1E10FAD9E6F.jpeg
I agree on the air filter deal,my 6" K and N filter only lost 3 hp on dyno.
I think the twin scoop set up on your car would look great.
200mph standing still :D
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Re: Dyno tuned 434 SBC 11:1 AFR 245 Solid Roller

Post by ChopperScott »

Made a few adjustments to the car. Shimmed up the trans mount to raise the crankshaft centerline and reduce driveline operating angles. Adjusted pinion angle accordingly at 1.9° below crank centerline. Extended instant center forward and down to 57.5" on the anti-squat line. Adjusted rear coil-over installed height and springs for a 1" lower rear ride height. A set of 2" drop spindles from Chassisworks up front. And new rotors and pads from Mark Williams in the rear.

I’ll be heading to Island Dragway for test and tune on Saturday, and competition on Sunday with NETO at the Nostalgia Nationals. I’m going to run the Quick Fuel 950 carb, tuned on the engine dyno, with a drop base air filter and the hood on this weekend.
Last edited by ChopperScott on Mon Jun 27, 2022 10:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
'73 Camaro Z/28 NETO/N
434 SBC 11:1, 1.294, 6.178 @ 108.87, 9.81 @ 134.93 (3060#, Naturally Aspirated, Sunoco Ultra 94)
Chopper Air Port 917-589-1278
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Re: Dyno tuned 434 SBC 11:1 AFR 245 Solid Roller

Post by ChopperScott »

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'73 Camaro Z/28 NETO/N
434 SBC 11:1, 1.294, 6.178 @ 108.87, 9.81 @ 134.93 (3060#, Naturally Aspirated, Sunoco Ultra 94)
Chopper Air Port 917-589-1278
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Re: Dyno tuned 434 SBC 11:1 AFR 245 Solid Roller

Post by ChopperScott »

Chassisworks Drop Spindle.JPG
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'73 Camaro Z/28 NETO/N
434 SBC 11:1, 1.294, 6.178 @ 108.87, 9.81 @ 134.93 (3060#, Naturally Aspirated, Sunoco Ultra 94)
Chopper Air Port 917-589-1278
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Re: Dyno tuned 434 SBC 11:1 AFR 245 Solid Roller

Post by ChopperScott »

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'73 Camaro Z/28 NETO/N
434 SBC 11:1, 1.294, 6.178 @ 108.87, 9.81 @ 134.93 (3060#, Naturally Aspirated, Sunoco Ultra 94)
Chopper Air Port 917-589-1278
ChopperScott
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Re: Dyno tuned 434 SBC 11:1 AFR 245 Solid Roller

Post by ChopperScott »

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'73 Camaro Z/28 NETO/N
434 SBC 11:1, 1.294, 6.178 @ 108.87, 9.81 @ 134.93 (3060#, Naturally Aspirated, Sunoco Ultra 94)
Chopper Air Port 917-589-1278
ChopperScott
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Re: Dyno tuned 434 SBC 11:1 AFR 245 Solid Roller

Post by ChopperScott »

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'73 Camaro Z/28 NETO/N
434 SBC 11:1, 1.294, 6.178 @ 108.87, 9.81 @ 134.93 (3060#, Naturally Aspirated, Sunoco Ultra 94)
Chopper Air Port 917-589-1278
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