Intake Runners!!! HELP!!!

[ralph85]

Sure there would. As mentioned by several above, the smaller runner will give you move velocity at low rpm and will seem snappier (is that a word?). However it will choke earlier at higher rpms. I've seen similar combos with 180s thru 200s run very close in the quarter mile, so for a street strip combo, i don't think the difference is huge. I've never used a 170, so i can't help ya there. Just don't lose sight of the future. I see it all the time where someone thinks they'll be satisfied with something and then 6 months later they want more. Porting heads is expensive, so keep your future needs in mind when you decide on a head initially. I really dont know your intended use or goals, so it's hard to make a recommendation. IMO, a 200 would be on the large side and 170 would be on the small side. The 200 probably wouldn't be optimal on the street, but would give you room to grow. The 170 will be more responsive at low rpms, but will limit your top end. The 180-190 runner might be a good compromise.

Brodix and Dart both make a 180 head for a little over $1000. The Brodie IK is alum and I wish i could tell you i've heard good things about them, but i haven't. The Dart Platnum alum is about $300 more than the iron head and Dart stuff is usually pretty good. Brodie makes a race rite 180 for about the same price, but i dont know anything about that head. The Edelborck stuff is usually good quality, but only have the 170. The AFR 180 Eliminator would be great choice, but it might be beyond the budget. Decisions, decisions..................good luck

[the383]

FYIW , chevy high performance did a bunch of dyno test and pulled off a set of double humps off a 355 and installed a set of Brodix i/k 180's and it picked up 24 lbs of torque and 47 horsepower at the flywheel. Jeg's list them for $1,014.99 assembled pair .

[want-a-be]

what lobe seperation does your cam have?

[chevyman18]

110, i believe

[automotive breath]

Let's try to help out the 18 year old a little more, I can see there is still
confusion. The majority of people are saying the same thing, 170cc port
will be a little more responsive in the intended RPM range.

The camshaft is a rather small Lunati hydraulic flat tappet cam that will be
all done by 6200 RPM. Just suppose he would build the 350 CI engine with
a decent unported head with a 170cc intake port and achieve his target
400 HP. Pull the heads and bolt on a very similar unported head with the
same valve size and 30 more cc volume in the intake runner, what should
he expect?



chevyman18, I have used the felpro rubber coated steel shim gaskets with
aluminum heads with good results, if the pistons are in the hole ~.025
thats the route I would take.

As for the Edelbrock heads, I'm very familiar with them. Not top of the line
but exceptional performance for the price. I know many people that run
these on 350 CI engines both street and strip. Good to bolt on and go and
room to grow if porting is an option later on down the road.

[CamKing]

Go with the edelbrock heads, and put a 1.6 rocker on the intakes.
I'd also go with the Victor Jr manifold if it'll fit under your hood.
We did a lot of back-2-back dyno tests, and with cams bigger then 220@.050", the vic-Jr didn't give up any torque to any of the performer intakes, and it made more power above 5,500.

[82 camaro]

I vote for vortec thay work really well and will keep you in your budget.

[bigjoe1]

I have sold about 40 or 50 350 SHERMANATOR engines. I tested lots of heads, and I found the GM vortech would make just as much power as many of the aftermarket heads up to 5500 RPM. Even though many heads flow more on the bench, they DO NOT make any more HP in real life.What worked the best was the protopline vortech ( RHS now ) with a little bit of rework, At 9.1 to one, a 224 extreme energy cam, rpm airgap and 750 carb, they would put out 408 to 412 HP,at 5800. and 405 to 410 torque at 4400. This combo would beat out the Edelbrock performer and the smaller DArt heads. only the AFR CNC ported 180 heads would make more HP (420-425)

JOE SHERMAN RACING ENGINES

[chevyman18]

doing the vortec setup will cost me almost the exact same as the eddys or darts. so its more of a preference/quality/performance decision now. and mostly everyone has said go with the smaller runner eddys than the darts.

[Troy Patterson]

And I've always got to through in my contrary two cents worth.

I'd run the Vic Jr. heads and intake with your cam, and 1.6 or more preferably 1.7 rocker ratio.

I know we can and have discussed cams and heads, cam and head combos and so forth, but my advice would be to achieve flow with larger ports and valves while running the smaller cam - you'll make more power than you expect - and have excellent drivability. This is the have your cake and eat it too path, perhaps with slightly more effort.

Now, a very generalized and oversimplified comment:
More often than not, in most cases, most of the time, loss of low end and mid range torque is due to camshaft and or poor fuel curve / carburetor build, NOT cylinder heads - but I will concede that tune or fuel curve is more important going this way, than the more conventional path.

Troy Patterson TMPCarbs.net TMP Carbs

[chevyman18]

trying to stay under a budget, otherwise i would go with some afr's or more expensive eddys.

[chevyman18]

Here is what a buddy of mine said about the 170cc or 200cc head choice. he owns an engine shop, and still does a little machine work. His info legit?

"You want to build a engine to go in your truck, Motor Home, or just a gas saving grocery getter than yes jump on the little 165cc heads!

Yes, Edelbrock are good heads
Yes, Vortec heads are great.

Compaired to what? Stock OEM Smog heads!

Well compair them to each other and what you get?

THE 200CC heads are not GIGANTIC! THEY DO NOT KILL THE ENGINE!

THEY MAKE HP! You not need to turn 10,000 rpm to make them work!"


"I have found very very small Hp & even smaller Torque number losses below 3500 rpm's on a 350 engine.

Yes, the bigger heads are better on the Larger 383/400plus CI engines.

That does not mean they will not work on a smaller engine."

[Ed-vancedEngines]

You are in the ball park with your line of thinking.

Forgetting the AFR becuase of budget. Look at the 23 degree Trick Flow and the 190-200 Canfield as sold from Competition Products.

I'll agree that the 170 should be more responsive off idle and at the bottom end. 180 cc usually works real good. I did put a set of the 200 or at times called 190 Canfields on a Production rebuilder essembled 350 Chevy Short Block with a cam like yours and flat top pistons using a vacuum 750 Holley and that thing had lots of low end power and was very responsive.

The Canfield 190-200 , Brodix 180, Trick Flow 23 degree, are all close to your budget and should work great. I am not familiar with the Dart offerings. There are also cheapo heads that might work but I have no confidence in them.

Ed

[BH]

The thing with this is there will probly always be a debate because of large area the internet covers. People from all altitudes will all have different results.

[chevyman18]

that is true. i just need to chose between dart I.E. plats 200cc 64cc, eddy performer rpm 170cc 64cc, or brodix ik180 180cc 64cc. anyone running an of these heads?