D V Live now.

[SpeierRacingHeads]

I don't think that team DV in the videos has ever stated the theory they use, is for a race engine.

Seems like they repeat street engine and RPM limits.

And yes, I just ordered a cam from Jones for the Super Stocker. The last was a Bullet.

[HQM383]

I don't think that team DV in the videos has ever stated the theory they use, is for a race engine.

Seems like they repeat street engine and RPM limits.

And yes, I just ordered a cam from Jones for the Super Stocker. The last was a Bullet.

He doesn’t delve into race engines when discussing his theory but has included applying it to race engines in publications

[juuhanaa]

Just curios, what's the combo?

SBC, iron heads (175cc, 255@.550"), 10-10.5:1, carb, open headers, drag racing, RPM ceiling of 6500 (proposed 6200 shift with auto and 4000 stall converter).
Third iteration of basically the same engine but now with ported heads. New converter and transmission as well.
Chassis specifics aren't set but a baseline is in place.

What are the stock cam specs?

[digger]

Yeah, in the early days it was oversold in terms of applicability.

[juuhanaa]

Maybe cheat a little using a higher intake rocker ratio. Retard the cam a bit and set the open headers lenght to some around 6000 and dont disturb the cam companies. Im not sure about the stock cam specs though,



-juhana

[juuhanaa]

Maybe cheat a little using a higher intake rocker ratio. Retard the cam a bit and set the open headers lenght to some around 6000 and dont disturb the cam companies. Im not sure about the stock cam specs though. What size dies you guys have for the headers?

Screenshot_20221029-202435.jpg

-juhana

[gunt]

That’s the way I see it too. It gives those guys confidence and ownership over their choice of cam in their personal build. If I’m reading it right he’s taking his years of testing, noticed the similarities of the best results and derived a formula from those. The good ‘ol hot rod guys and performance street builds will then be guided toward what made those test successful over the years. The formula has rules for its inputs so it’s corralling you towards a result, which is fine because that’s its intention. Below is what I mean by input rules from an old thread:

This is why it suits me as this is what I'm presently putting together.
We'll see what comes out the woodwork here when I lay those TM results out on the table and compare them with other recommendations.

Why not call Mike Jones who actually designs cams, has real experience with countless race teams and racers, and actually grinds the cams, just don't understand why anyone wouldn't do that. Or call Bullet, or LSM, or Erson, or Howards etc. But Mike's cams work well, he knows what you need, and why wouldn't you support the guy who saved this site, and keeps it going.

is this a kinda refering to the fact that he does not have a cam company or design cams , knowing what you want might just be enough , in his past eurpoean cam companies made their fortune on him testing and giving them the data with advice , he is an independant and will always be , now there another guy [ most will not be familure ] bisimoto , the man is pure magic but realy busy business man , i'd say cars are only the sideline chemical companies are him main ting , but he got a cam done under his name , for an engine that had being around long before he played with them , independntly tested his cam netted 70bhp over the rest and even at that some were bigger cams , and this was a small 1.5-6cc engien turboed ,

and as reguards to racing , the weakest link of any car is the muppet behind the wheel , i have taken on customers over the years , some could drive but had no money some had money couldn't drive and had no intention of paying you

[hoffman900]

This is why it suits me as this is what I'm presently putting together.
We'll see what comes out the woodwork here when I lay those TM results out on the table and compare them with other recommendations.

Why not call Mike Jones who actually designs cams, has real experience with countless race teams and racers, and actually grinds the cams, just don't understand why anyone wouldn't do that. Or call Bullet, or LSM, or Erson, or Howards etc. But Mike's cams work well, he knows what you need, and why wouldn't you support the guy who saved this site, and keeps it going.

is this a kinda refering to the fact that he does not have a cam company or design cams , knowing what you want might just be enough , in his past eurpoean cam companies made their fortune on him testing and giving them the data with advice , he is an independant and will always be , now there another guy [ most will not be familure ] bisimoto , the man is pure magic but realy busy business man , i'd say cars are only the sideline chemical companies are him main ting , but he got a cam done under his name , for an engine that had being around long before he played with them , independntly tested his cam netted 70bhp over the rest and even at that some were bigger cams , and this was a small 1.5-6cc engien turboed ,

and as reguards to racing , the weakest link of any car is the muppet behind the wheel , i have taken on customers over the years , some could drive but had no money some had money couldn't drive and had no intention of paying you

I’m sorry, but Bisi did not magically find 70hp on a Porsche 911 turbo over everyone.

I don't think that team DV in the videos has ever stated the theory they use, is for a race engine.

Seems like they repeat street engine and RPM limits.

And yes, I just ordered a cam from Jones for the Super Stocker. The last was a Bullet.

Bullet seems good for those Stock / Super Stock / other drag classes… they have some really aggressive lobes, but Mike would be my guy if I needed really good power and something that could hold together for more than 300 miles and was a road race / circle track combination.

[skinny z]

Bullet seems good for those Stock / Super Stock / other drag classes… they have some really aggressive lobes, but Mike would be my guy if I needed really good power and something that could hold together for more than 300 miles and was a road race / circle track combination.

The standout part of that sentence is the reference to Mike. I'm inclined to go there as well.

But my real question is can I have that expertise in lasting more than 300 miles AND overachieve at the dragstrip?
I'll be calling him to ask but for now, I'm just throwing that out there.

[hoffman900]

Bullet seems good for those Stock / Super Stock / other drag classes… they have some really aggressive lobes, but Mike would be my guy if I needed really good power and something that could hold together for more than 300 miles and was a road race / circle track combination.

The standout part of that sentence is the reference to Mike. I'm inclined to go there as well.
But my real question is can I have that expertise in lasting more than 300 miles AND overachieve at the dragstrip?
I'll be calling him to ask but for now, I'm just throwing that out there.

I think you’re chasing diminishing gains here and as I mentioned elsewhere, suffering from some analysis paralysis.

A Super Stock engine is a tool to win with. How many miles do most them go before rebuilds? 50 (200 passes)? They will sacrifice 20hp for reliability.

Mike’s background is in Indy Cars and other open wheel classes that have to survive in scenarios where an engine is goinf to be raced for 500 miles (plus cool down, etc), so let’s call it 600 miles. That’s 2400 drag race passes.

His pushrod stuff works great. I know of a BMC A-Series application where his first guess was better than the Vizard developed, Crane designed, scatter-pattern cams. With a restricted intake set up, his made a hair more power but used less gas to do so. When it was uncorked, it was no contest. Those are pushrod applications spinning to 9000rpm with 8.7in pushrods.

That said, when I think of Bullet, I think of those hard hitting Brookshire lobes and other ones designed by John. Their niche definitely seems to be in the drag race space.

People also seem to forget that Harold worked at Custom Camshaft Company (Arringtons) and did NASCAR, Pro Stock, and other lobes there (cut on a CNC) and he said he updated most of the Ultradyne stuff and did it better. Howards has all that stuff you and you can find it in their lobe catalogue, if that’s your cup of tea.

The last commercially available Brookshire designed lobes are at Lunati. Those are the Lunati TL2 and TR2 lobe families. These and the Howards collection would obsolete the Ultradydne stuff if that’s what you want.

Comp / Crane has a bit of everything, and you really need to hire someone like Billy as a consultant to navigate that catalogue to find something that works. Ironically, Comp’s low shock profiles came from flipping Harold’s designs backwards on the Spintron and they worked better dynamically. Go figure.

A classic example of focusing on dynamics was the Ilmor 500l. Jeff Williams secretly calmed down the design of the camshaft and they found 100hp and the engine responded to developmental changes.

[SpeierRacingHeads]

I will say this. On my SS engine. Both Mike and Bullet were dead nuts on duration and lift. But Mike was much wider on LSA. And I think he's right.

I went with Mike because we think a lot alike.

However, I still want that 20 hp!

[hoffman900]

I will say this. On my SS engine. Both Mike and Bullet were dead nuts on duration and lift. But Mike was much wider on LSA. And I think he's right.

I went with Mike because we think a lot alike.

However, I still want that 20 hp!

Nice.

I’m not saying Mike can’t or doesn’t have hard hitting lobes, just that’s not what I think of him for. I do think Mike has a good feel for how an engine is used on track and how the power curve should look.

If racing and you’re losing, it’s probably not the camshaft designer. So much more to it

[SpeierRacingHeads]

I will say this. On my SS engine. Both Mike and Bullet were dead nuts on duration and lift. But Mike was much wider on LSA. And I think he's right.

I went with Mike because we think a lot alike.

However, I still want that 20 hp!

Nice.

I’m not saying Mike can’t or doesn’t have hard hitting lobes, just that’s not what I think of him for. I do think Mike has a good feel for how an engine is used on track and how the power curve should look.

If racing and you’re losing, it’s probably not the camshaft designer.

I like how Mike does it. Everything I've asked/ordered for myself or customer comes with a note like: This cam is easy on parts. This cam here isn't. I like that.

[bob460]

I will say this. On my SS engine. Both Mike and Bullet were dead nuts on duration and lift. But Mike was much wider on LSA. And I think he's right.

I went with Mike because we think a lot alike.

However, I still want that 20 hp!

Chad any chance you can compare them on your dyno sim program?

[SpeierRacingHeads]

I will say this. On my SS engine. Both Mike and Bullet were dead nuts on duration and lift. But Mike was much wider on LSA. And I think he's right.

I went with Mike because we think a lot alike.

However, I still want that 20 hp!

Chad any chance you can compare them on your dyno sim program?

I had dynomation and lost the key.

I don't have anyway anymore. I did have a friend run Mikes cam on DM6. I have that data.

All I can add is I need more peak RPM, both both cams were smaller. It's going to be interesting!