New Casting Idea

[SchmidtMotorWorks]

I have a blank cope and drag set (the base foundry tooling needed to cast a head or manifold) sitting collecting dust at my shop.

All it needs is a good idea for a casting, (preferably something commercially viable).

If you have an idea for something to make, please post it.

[Powertrip]

That's interesting, Jon.
Something I want to design and cast one day is an updated version of the Gen 2 Hemi head. Radically flattened valve angles, faster combustion chambers, light pistons, better valve train geometry.
It probably hasn't been already done because there is no return on investment potential. I guess I'll just have to work on it with my CNC machinist son.
It will look cool in the engine bays of my old Mopars when I finally get it done.

[CamKing]

I have an idea for a manifold, and maybe we can talk Rick Roberts into helping.

[SchmidtMotorWorks]

I have an idea for a manifold, and maybe we can talk Rick Roberts into helping.

Rick might be coming over to visit this weekend, have you discussed it with him yet?

[SchmidtMotorWorks]

That's interesting, Jon.
Something I want to design and cast one day is an updated version of the Gen 2 Hemi head. Radically flattened valve angles, faster combustion chambers, light pistons, better valve train geometry.
It probably hasn't been already done because there is no return on investment potential. I guess I'll just have to work on it with my CNC machinist son.
It will look cool in the engine bays of my old Mopars when I finally get it done.

IIRC there was a narrow valve angle head made for the Gen II Hemi, but not in production.
I have experimented with it in CAD and found that as crude as the original design looks, it is very difficult to make more compact without running into problems in the context of a 2 plug nitro configuration.

I wonder what the market is for Gen II Hemi stuff for street cars going forward, are people swapping in Gen 3 engines into vintage cars?
It seems like a good idea technically, but I don't know if people would do it.
I guess they would want a carb style intake manifold.

The Gen 3 head looks like it has more R&D time in it than the the Gen II did.
Richard Moser worked on the development of the race Hemi, he used to come over and visit some times, the way he told it, that engine was designed and running in a few months. When an engine is put together at that speed in the 60's, it means that the foundry pattern maker made a lot of the design decisions as he made the tooling (and he may not have even known what the four strokes of an engine were).

[SchmidtMotorWorks]

OC Performance makes a carbed intake for the Gen 3

[CamKing]

I have an idea for a manifold, and maybe we can talk Rick Roberts into helping.

Rick might be coming over to visit this weekend, have you discussed it with him yet?

Just did.

[Powertrip]

That's interesting, Jon.
Something I want to design and cast one day is an updated version of the Gen 2 Hemi head. Radically flattened valve angles, faster combustion chambers, light pistons, better valve train geometry.
It probably hasn't been already done because there is no return on investment potential. I guess I'll just have to work on it with my CNC machinist son.
It will look cool in the engine bays of my old Mopars when I finally get it done.

IIRC there was a narrow valve angle head made for the Gen II Hemi, but not in production.
I have experimented with it in CAD and found that as crude as the original design looks, it is very difficult to make more compact without running into problems in the context of a 2 plug nitro configuration.

I wonder what the market is for Gen II Hemi stuff for street cars going forward, are people swapping in Gen 3 engines into vintage cars?
It seems like a good idea technically, but I don't know if people would do it.
I guess they would want a carb style intake manifold.

The Gen 3 head looks like it has more R&D time in it than the the Gen II did.
Richard Moser worked on the development of the race Hemi, he used to come over and visit some times, the way he told it, that engine was designed and running in a few months. When an engine is put together at that speed in the 60's, it means that the foundry pattern maker made a lot of the design decisions as he made the tooling (and he may not have even known what the four strokes of an engine were).

If you are not worried about 2 plugs and nitro, I'm sure it can be made more compact. Just look at the Gen 3 heads.
People are swapping Gen 3 motors into vintage muscle cars, but they really don't perform any better than a well built small block. And not even close to a good Gen 2. Unless all you want to do is cruise at 55 mph with the air on.
I have read numerous articles about the development of the Gen 2, and it is obvious that it was rushed into production and therefore many design compromises were made.
That is why I want an updated version. Would it be a commercial success? Doubt it in this day and age, but I still want a couple of sets for my cars!

[SchmidtMotorWorks]

People are swapping Gen 3 motors into vintage muscle cars, but they really don't perform any better than a well built small block. And not even close to a good Gen 2. Unless all you want to do is cruise at 55 mph with the air on.

I don't know much about how they do naturally aspirated, but I watched a supercharger development project in the dyno cell next to mine at Edelbrock and a 392 got past 1,000. IIRC, I don't think they even took the heads off it.

I prototyped a nice modern cross-ram EFI manifold for the Gen 3, but it never got priority to dyno because the supercharged stuff has all the interest.

It has been a long time since I looked into this, but I was interested in a narrow valve angle Hemi more than 10 years ago. I think the head I was looking at was a D3 head (or something like that)? I don't remember the details now, but someone that raced them talked me out of the idea.

[Keith Morganstein]

A crossflow Head for the Ford 300 /4.9 in-line six.
The current option is to section and weld LS heads (three pieces cut from two heads)

[SchmidtMotorWorks]

A crossflow Head for the Ford 300 /4.9 in-line six.
The current option is to section and weld LS heads (three pieces cut from two heads)

That would be too long for my cope and drag.

But it could be made in other ways.
How many do you think could be sold?

[Keith Morganstein]

I don’t know how many, but it would sell. It still a popular engine and owners like to hot rod it. I’m sure it would depend on the price point.

There is one big six guy that is wanting to sell ported new heads (EQ makes the casting, OE replacement, CI, U-flow head)
He has a waiting list at (I think ) $1800 for an assembled ported iron head, but seems to be having trouble getting them out the door.
The same person is wanting to sell welded LS heads as a commercial product. The LS head is a remarkably good fit, but welded of three pieces is always dicey.

Classic inlines made a head for the small “falcon” six. The owner passed and now it’s owned and sold by Vintage inlines. They produce a run of heads and manifolds, sell them out, then make another run...

The original owner of Classic inlines had a big six head in the works before he passed away. With the core boxes and test castings made in Australia. From what I understand, the boxes need some rework.

There was also a OEM Ford crossflow head (cast iron) that was being field tested pre-production. Ford needed a crossflow if the engine was to continue emissions compliant, but Ford dropped the inline six before putting it into production. No one knows where those boxes are, but I know where at least one head is.

Alan Johnson made solid (dry) billet heads for a while, but those were very expensive,and only for comp drag racing.

[SchmidtMotorWorks]

I looked around for a 300 around home. Found nothing on CL but did find a core on eBay for $800.
Funny thing was the ad below it was for a Mercedes V12 for $1800.
I thought maybe it would make more sense to put the Mercedes engine in as a swap than to swap a head.

Looking at other options, the Jaguar 6 and 12 engines are plentiful and inexpensive. Would those be attractive to swap?

[autogear]

I remember seeing a few T-buckets with V12 jag engines and rear axles when I was a kid. Cool stuff.

I bet Jack Vines could come up with some interesting casting needs, trying to extort money from the Packard-Stude crowd is always interesting.

On the transmission front, a nice midplate for the ST-10 crowd is always curious. People just resort to billet and they're either not well done, or stupid expensive

[Keith Morganstein]

I looked around for a 300 around home. Found nothing on CL but did find a core on eBay for $800.
Funny thing was the ad below it was for a Mercedes V12 for $1800.
I thought maybe it would make more sense to put the Mercedes engine in as a swap than to swap a head.

Looking at other options, the Jaguar 6 and 12 engines are plentiful and inexpensive. Would those be attractive to swap?

plenty of cores, just maybe not in CA.

300's are in Trucks of course and people love old pick ups.

The inline folks hang out on inliners.com, ford-six.com, ford-trucks.com, the hamb etc...

The engine that gets swapped into cars and some trucks is the GM Atlas six, 4.2 DOHC from trailblazers etc..

Of course plenty swap for V8's but that is a very saturated aftermarket.