Well they finally did it

Engine tech, for those engines, products, and technologies of yesteryear.

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Belgian1979
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Well they finally did it

Post by Belgian1979 »

The gov here implemented tech inspection every 2 years for oldtimers between 30 and 50, every 5 years when older than 50. The sad thing is that all mods are banned. They may only be original.
Right now about 50 % of all oldtimers here are banned from the road as a consequence. Mine included (for the only reason that I have an ITB fuel injection on the engine - rest is original...)

It sure is a victory for the purists.

I really start to hate the EU which is at the basis of this regulation. It has become sort of a communistic regime...
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Re: Well they finally did it

Post by CamKing »

With Biden as President, the US will be right behind you.
Our EPA was already planning on making it illegal to modify any production car for racing purposes. Even if it would never see anything but a track.
When Trump put his people in the EPA, that went away.
Biden's EPA picks will be even more unfriendly to racers, then Obama's EPA. It's al part of "The Green New Deal".
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Belgian1979
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Re: Well they finally did it

Post by Belgian1979 »

Well if they expect me to invest my money in a driving cell phone...they will be mistaken.
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Re: Well they finally did it

Post by BCjohnny »

Belgian1979 wrote: I really start to hate the EU which is at the basis of this regulation. It has become sort of a communistic regime...
Sorry to sidetrack the thread ...... but why do you think the UK has spent more than four years trying to leave the EU ?

That's just the tip of the Iceberg ..... regulations enforcing the 'straightness of bananas' anyone ?

Only when a car here more than forty years old changes hands in the UK apart from an initial MOT, and assuming there are no further 'substantial modifications' (when it simply needs another MOT) the vehicle requires no other test whilst owned by that person

On the last day of this month, at 11pm local time, we be will be rid of this nonsense for good ..... and you're welcome to it ....
Belgian1979
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Re: Well they finally did it

Post by Belgian1979 »

Unfortunately I don't see a lot of countries where it's getting any better. Look at the bans for ICE cars. Electric cars never got off in the past for very good reasons, and it has not changed much.
My suspicion is that they want electric cars because most homes will be going off grid sooner or later and then they loose the reason for the utilities and electric grid that the industry needs. So they make electric cars obligatory.

Meanwhile this already has the effect that a lot of the speedshops around here are going out of business.
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Re: Well they finally did it

Post by modok »

So maybe you have a winter engine and a summer engine.
I hope there is a provision to allow improved brakes, tires and suspension.
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Re: Well they finally did it

Post by Geoff2 »

Here in Australia in my state , all cars over 3 yrs old require a yearly tech inspection. Some modifications are allowed for street driven cars.
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Re: Well they finally did it

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modok wrote: Sun Dec 06, 2020 9:37 pm So maybe you have a winter engine and a summer engine.
I hope there is a provision to allow improved brakes, tires and suspension.
Nope, only all original...
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Re: Well they finally did it

Post by Belgian1979 »

Geoff2 wrote: Mon Dec 07, 2020 2:08 am Here in Australia in my state , all cars over 3 yrs old require a yearly tech inspection. Some modifications are allowed for street driven cars.
I know, you also do have a hot rod legislation. Around here it's nada now.
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Re: Well they finally did it

Post by chimpvalet »

There is a worrying trend against automobiles in general and that has been for some time. The difference between how we thought of cars in our youth versus how cars are seen by younger people today is remarkable. That said, it's impossible to ban cars altogether, impossible to fully shift over to electrical, and fuel burning ICE's will be with us for a long time as consequence. Regulators everywhere are a pain, annoying most people most of the time. Canada's federal government has just presented legislation outlining "Clean Fuel Standards", which will likely mean expanded use of ethanol in gasoline. May not be so bad for gearheads if E85 becomes widely available and loopholes for older hobby cars remain.
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Re: Well they finally did it

Post by emsvitil »

Belgian1979 wrote: Wed Dec 09, 2020 4:25 pm
modok wrote: Sun Dec 06, 2020 9:37 pm So maybe you have a winter engine and a summer engine.
I hope there is a provision to allow improved brakes, tires and suspension.
Nope, only all original...
All original will produce more smog and be less safe................
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Re: Well they finally did it

Post by Camaromeo »

In germany we have always had the TÜV. Need to check the car every 2 years.

Those guys.. man. IF you want to change/tune up stuff, it has to be era-according, meaning must have been available at the time of production up to max. of 10 years later. So weiand compressor for example is ok, EFI is definitely not for 60s cars.
The ONLY thing they allow to install without problems is disc brakes and seat belts.

On the other hand, you can install EFI, BUT you lose oldtimer status. Meaning you have to pay "normal" , not oltimer, insurance and taxes.
What do you think they take as taxes for 6-10l displacement engines with zero emission control and what do insurance companies take for those 2t cars with 4 non boosted drum brakes and 500 hp?
Tax would be unimaginiably high like several thousands per year, same as insurance, IF they take your car at all..

so everybody wants to keep oldtimer status. I mean it makes sense, this era according stuff. But it comes at the cost of freedom in this hobby..
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Re: Well they finally did it

Post by chimpvalet »

In the western province of Canada where I reside we no longer have emissions compliance at all. For decades through the '90's and on well into the 2000's there was mandatory testing for all in the densely populated regions, then that was terminated for political reasons alone. So while we have the occasional old Honda running about with deleted catalyst and/or out of tune on worn carburetors the bigger issue is ever increasing deletion of controls on newer large diesel powered pick-ups. Even quite recent diesels have been troubled with costly repairs to deteriorating urea additive systems, and owners are taking the stuff offline in order to save money.

On modifying old timers, the local lobby for old American hot cars is a force in advising government on policy so latitude for updates and mods on cars up to model year '74 ( end of the Pony Car era, apparently ) are permitted while retaining very inexpensive insurance. Good luck to any who'd wish to improve the emissions/performance of a car that's '75 onward.
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Re: Well they finally did it

Post by NewbVetteGuy »

Terrible kind of regulation...

I think I probably have a slightly different opinion than many / most on here. About 1/3 of SMOG and 28% of total greenhouse emissions come from automobiles in the US, so I get that, but most cars that would fall under these regulations are driven so few miles in a year, it's kind of pointless.

If the goal is reducing pollution, then just mandate they go on the sniffer. If the goal is total CO2 emissions then tie a maximum # of miles driven to the fuel economy. At least then you incentivize the right behaviors -> you can put "non-original" high perf cats on your classic car and maintain a good tune up or do an EFI conversion and pass emissions and if these improvements improve your fuel economy, then you can drive the car more.

-Increases the market for retrofit solutions for classic cars that reduce emissions and improve fuel economy, too.

If the car barely gets driven then the fuel economy doesn't matter in the general scheme of CO2 emissions.

-Also helps stop the ridiculous "rolling coal" diesel crap.


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Re: Well they finally did it

Post by NewbVetteGuy »

Camaromeo wrote: Thu Dec 10, 2020 6:23 am
On the other hand, you can install EFI, BUT you lose oldtimer status. Meaning you have to pay "normal" , not oltimer, insurance and taxes.
What do you think they take as taxes for 6-10l displacement engines with zero emission control and what do insurance companies take for those 2t cars with 4 non boosted drum brakes and 500 hp?
Tax would be unimaginiably high like several thousands per year, same as insurance, IF they take your car at all..

so everybody wants to keep oldtimer status. I mean it makes sense, this era according stuff. But it comes at the cost of freedom in this hobby..
Do you have the exception to the "gas guzzler" / engine displacement taxes for registered "Taxi" vehicles in Germany?

When I lived in Ireland the "gas guzzler" / large engine displacement taxes started at 1.8 liters and up, but the loophole was that registered Taxis don't have to pay the tax. Anyone who wanted a high performance vehicle would just pay to get their car (not themselves as a driver; that was a horrifiic process) registered as a Taxi as it ended up MANY times cheaper than paying the gas guzzler tax.


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