Ford 289 Camshaft Manifold Carburetor

[Heinz1]

i am building a Ford 289 Windsor engine for Historic Rally and some Street use.
The Engine must have good street driving manners.
Because of the Rules i have to use the stock Block and stock iron Cylinderheads.
I want to make around 280 Hp.

What i have:
289 Stock Block with forged Pistons
stock iron Heads, 10:1 Compression
stock iron 4V intake manifold
Holley 1460 Carburetor, 600cfm, vacuum secondary, upgraded to a secondary metering block for easy main jet changes.

Which Camshaft, Intake manifold and Carburetor would you use / recommend ?

Thank you
Heinz

[PackardV8]

Greetings, Heinz,

Been there, done that in 1966.

Will anyone be closely checking block casting numbers? If not, the best investment in horsepower is a complete late 302" hydraulic roller cam short block. There are better cams than the OEM Ford, but none less expensive.

You don't mention which heads you have, but most likely they don't have screw in studs. For performance work with better valve springs, screw in studs are a necessity.

The valves are seldom checked closely. Today, I'd try to sneak in Chevy LS 8mm valves and beehive springs.

You say you already have the stock intake and then ask which intake to use. Can you use an aftermarket aluminum high-rise intake? If so, does it have to fit under a stock hood?

Are headers allowed?

jack vines

[frnkeore]

If the rules allow, I would go with at least a Edel 2121 or better a 7121. A little less weight, too.

A stock 271 HP cam (228 @.050, 114 LSA), that manifold, headers and a good valve job, would get you 280 hp.

At least 300 hp, with the 7121, 230 @.050 on 108 or 109 LSA and a little bowl work.

You also have to take care of the details, for the build (blueprint+).

[PackardV8]

If the rules allow, I would go with at least a Edel 2121 or better a 7121. A little less weight, too.

A stock 271 HP cam (228 @.050, 114 LSA), that manifold, headers and a good valve job, would get you 280 hp.

At least 300 hp, with the 7121, 230 @.050 on 108 or 109 LSA and a little bowl work.

You also have to take care of the details, for the build (blueprint+).

You're a better man than I am, Gunga Din. I've never made 280hp with OEM 289" heads and the HiPo cam and Ford didn't either. Add in at least $2000 in professional porting and valve work and then I've seen it happen.

[Mummert]

1965 no smog 289 heads are good for the power all day long, the factory iron 4 barrel manifold might not be. A nice 650 double pumper and a performer rpm and your done. LS intake valves are nice upgrade. The intake valve profile is perfect for 289 heads, 1.89" o.d it down a little bit 1.84 1.86. Its very hard to find LS exh valves that arent 25* tulip. Truth of the matter is an OEM 1.5" single groove VORTEC sbc valve is perfect on the exhaust side, very nice little valve.
Mid 230's at .050 .520 lift 108-110 LSA

[frnkeore]

Add in at least $2000 in professional porting and valve work and then I've seen it happen.

Geoff, would have to speak to how much he had in his heads, on his 450+ hp 289 EMC engine.

I played around with a set of C6 heads, w/o touching the SSR and got 196 cfm @ .500. Just 1.9 LS valve and blending the bowl into the port And I never ported anything before that.

[Geoff2]

If you want to win the race, use four Webers. RaceTep in Calif should have the complete package.

[Mummert]

Add in at least $2000 in professional porting and valve work and then I've seen it happen.

Geoff, would have to speak to how much he had in his heads, on his 450+ hp 289 EMC engine.

I played around with a set of C6 heads, w/o touching the SSR and got 196 cfm @ .500. Just 1.9 LS valve and blending the bowl into the port And I never ported anything before that.

Play with your short turns a little, the way your had levels hard at .400 it will pick up a 10-15 cfm pretty quick. The 1.6 exhaust is pretty big, its got high 70's % all the way up. You've got the makings of some 400hp heads with a few more hours of work.

[frnkeore]

Geoff, thank you, very much, for your advice. I think your one of the very best engine builders in the US, especially on SB stuff.

I intentionally left SSR alone, to see what it would do with the ball end mill, I used to start the port work (inside and out side radii). Besides that, as a person that's never done port work, laying back the SSR, is very difficult to do on the back side of it and I was afraid I'd do more harm than good. But, what really stopped me from doing more was the lack of flow on the Ex. I got a large CSA on it, and what looked like a good flow path, all the way out but, very little flow increase, for the size. I talked with Steve (mag2525), while doing this. He helped me A LOT. The Ex had already been port matched and the bottom of the exit, had been lowered. He thought that might be the problem. Also, these are "M" smog heads.

The only reason I even started on them, was because they had screw in studs and good retainers and springs and they were free. The motivation came from your EMC results with Bill C's heads, as well as Carnut1's porting thread.

I compared my numbers, with some of the Stan Weiss SBF's and these seem to have very good low lift flow on both valves so, I thought I'd put them on my 331 engine, in my '48 truck, with a Howards 217 @.050 x .501 lift cam, 223 x .491 Ex.

[Heinz1]

Thank you all for your competent advice.
@ Jack
I have a 302 / 5.0 Ltr. engine from a Mustang SN94, but cannot use it, have to use the stock 289 block and cylinder heads, they check the numbers.
Have Headers, but we build them ourselves, using Larry Meaux Pipemax Software.
@ frnkeore, Mummert

the factory iron 4 barrel manifold might not be. A nice 650 double pumper and a performer rpm and your done.

Thats what i have thought and why i asked about the use of the factory iron manifold.
Also, good advice about the use of 8mm Valves, we will use them.

So, what do you think about this parts combo:
COMP Cams Magnum Hydraulic Cam and Lifter Kits K31-226-3,Advertised Duration 280/280, Lift .512/.512, Ford 221-302, Kit.
Holley 650, 4150 Double Pumper Carburetors 0-4777C
Edelbrock 7121 / 71213 intake manifold

@ Geoff2
Webers are a good advice, but not allowed to use.
I have a Customer with a 1968 Mustang 289 and 4 Weber 44IDF for Road use, they run very good.

Thank you
Heinz

[Mummert]

That cams work well used one in my own car. good mid range pulls hard to 6k. It will pull past 6k if you need to push it in a short section.

[PackardV8]

Thank you all for your competent advice.
@ Jack

Also, good advice about the use of 8mm Valves, we will use them.

Thank you
Heinz

IIRC, we were able to put 8mm/5/16" bronze guide liners in the existing 11/32" guides and not have to change the guides.

jack vines

[Mummert]

Thank you all for your competent advice.
@ Jack

Also, good advice about the use of 8mm Valves, we will use them.

Thank you
Heinz

IIRC, we were able to put 8mm/5/16" bronze guide liners in the existing 11/32" guides and not have to change the guides.

jack vines

If the guides are in very good condition 5/16" liners work well. My guides had some hourglass. I used 8mm liners which take a .347" ream and was just enough to make them straight. An 1851S liner was used, I kept 1 sample

[BILL-C]

My crew and I have rebuilt 30 + Shelby GT 350 hi-po 289's for restoration shops. COMP nostalgia + solid flat tappet cam kit, original Shelby aluminum intake, original restored Holley carb, chevy 305 vortec 1.84 , 1.5 valves, 1 hour of bowl blending for oversize valves, and normal perf building practices produce 306 HP and 306 TQ like clockwork with small tube headers and pump gas.

[Heinz1]

BILL-C,
very good info, Thank you.
Which COMP nostalgia + solid flat tappet cam kit do you recommend?

This one ? COMP Cams CL31-334-4 - COMP Cams Magnum Solid Cam and Lifter Kits

Thank you
Heinz