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Building A Nostalgic 1970s Fuelie Headed 350 SBC

General engine tech -- Drag Racing to Circle Track

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Re: Building A Nostalgic 1970s Fuelie Headed 350 SBC

Post by Old School »

vortecpro wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 9:46 am
Monza355 wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 4:13 am This is amazing. Beautiful engine by the way ! Is it going in the dyno ?
Can you tell us more about the car setup the engine is going in ?
Heres the good news- it will be dyno tested today. The car is a NHRA legal F/SA Chevy II, that has been put on the street, T350 8 inch converter, 4.10 gear TRRC 12 bolt, 2900 pounds ready to run.
What will be the static compression ratio? What does the intake port flow at .600 lift? Thanks
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Re: Building A Nostalgic 1970s Fuelie Headed 350 SBC

Post by Carnut1 »

I love how guys think fuelies done right can't make great power. A well done set can be 260 / 200 cfm. A number the untouched rpm will not keep up with. Love this project! Thanks, Charlie
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Re: Building A Nostalgic 1970s Fuelie Headed 350 SBC

Post by n2omike »

Carnut1 wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 5:40 pm I love how guys think fuelies done right can't make great power. A well done set can be 260 / 200 cfm. A number the untouched rpm will not keep up with. Love this project! Thanks, Charlie
There's a BIG difference between the 'typical' flat top 350 with double jump heads and a flat tappet 0.515" lift cam that has been done a million times and runs 14's on a good day... and one that is fully optimized with a great port job, attention to detail and powering a great chassis.

An engine CAN make good power with a set of these heads that have been fully worked over... But it will run great despite having these head castings... not because of having them.

THIS being said, I fully ported a set of 289 heads back in the day, and ran extremely well... but it takes a massive effort and a LOT of hours behind the grinder. 289 heads were my specialty. Back before all the Ford aftermarket heads came out, SBF engines were turds without a ton of grinding. Factory SBC heads were a LOT better by comparison... but still nothing compared to what is available now.
Last edited by n2omike on Mon May 03, 2021 8:34 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Building A Nostalgic 1970s Fuelie Headed 350 SBC

Post by 1980RS »

vortecpro wrote: Sun May 02, 2021 8:07 pm
1980RS wrote: Sun May 02, 2021 3:28 pm I would say "no way" but since Mark is building this you can bet he will find a way to make it run what he says it will. :mrgreen:
I'am curious why you would say no way?
Not sure if it's possible at Denver, but at a track closer to sea level I can see it happening. Guys I see at the track where I go have more than 500hp with a light car (3K) and can barely get into the 11's, "you" will have no problem getting into the 10's like you did with your peanut port engine.
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Re: Building A Nostalgic 1970s Fuelie Headed 350 SBC

Post by Carnut1 »

n2omike wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 7:52 pm
Carnut1 wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 5:40 pm I love how guys think fuelies done right can't make great power. A well done set can be 260 / 200 cfm. A number the untouched rpm will not keep up with. Love this project! Thanks, Charlie
There's a BIG difference between the 'typical' flat top 350 with double jump heads and a flat tappet 0.515" lift cam that has been done a million times and runs 14's on a good day... and one that is fully optimized with a great port job, attention to detail and powering a great chassis.

An engine CAN make good power with a set of these heads that have been fully worked over... But it will run great despite having these head castings... not because of having them.

THIS being said, I fully ported a set of 289 heads back in the day, and ran extremely well... but it takes a massive effort and a LOT of hours behind the grinder. 289 heads were my specialty. Back before all the Ford aftermarket heads came out, SBF engines were turds without a ton of grinding. Factory SBC heads were a LOT better by comparison... but still nothing compared to what is available now.
viewtopic.php?p=700221&sid=ca07f1cd09fc ... 5c#p700221 I have an idea what you mean. Thanks, Charlie
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Re: Building A Nostalgic 1970s Fuelie Headed 350 SBC

Post by PRH »

A friend of mine runs a 68 Firebird in Stock.

He wanted to try something different, so he build a 350 for it(usually runs a 400).
Heads have 1.96” intake valves, cam is only .420 lift...... weighs around 3250 with that motor in it.

10.99 on its first pass down the track.

You have to think it could go quicker if you had a little more free reign with the heads and cam.
Somewhat handy with a die grinder.
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Re: Building A Nostalgic 1970s Fuelie Headed 350 SBC

Post by ClassicRob »

PRH wrote: Tue May 04, 2021 11:44 am A friend of mine runs a 68 Firebird in Stock.

He wanted to try something different, so he build a 350 for it(usually runs a 400).
Heads have 1.96” intake valves, cam is only .420 lift...... weighs around 3250 with that motor in it.

10.99 on its first pass down the track.

You have to think it could go quicker if you had a little more free reign with the heads and cam.
Pontiac 350 or Chevrolet 350? Big difference there. lol

BTW - I think Pontiac 350's are underappreciated.
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Re: Building A Nostalgic 1970s Fuelie Headed 350 SBC

Post by PRH »

Well, he runs it in Stock...... so it kinda has to be a Pontiac.

I posted a couple of pics and flow numbers for some 186 SBC heads in your old school build thread.

The heads on this Pontiac 350 flow way less than those did.
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Re: Building A Nostalgic 1970s Fuelie Headed 350 SBC

Post by ClassicRob »

PRH wrote: Tue May 04, 2021 1:43 pm Well, he runs it in Stock...... so it kinda has to be a Pontiac.

I posted a couple of pics and flow numbers for some 186 SBC heads in your old school build thread.

The heads on this Pontiac 350 flow way less than those did.
I used to run a 75 Esprit with a 350 - I really loved that car. Will check out my thread. Thanks!
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Re: Building A Nostalgic 1970s Fuelie Headed 350 SBC

Post by af2 »

ClassicRob wrote: Tue May 04, 2021 6:23 pm
PRH wrote: Tue May 04, 2021 1:43 pm Well, he runs it in Stock...... so it kinda has to be a Pontiac.

I posted a couple of pics and flow numbers for some 186 SBC heads in your old school build thread.

The heads on this Pontiac 350 flow way less than those did.
I used to run a 75 Esprit with a 350 - I really loved that car. Will check out my thread. Thanks!
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Re: Building A Nostalgic 1970s Fuelie Headed 350 SBC

Post by skinny z »

vortecpro wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 11:22 pm Building a 4.060 X 3.480 360 inch SBC, 618 2 bolt block, factory 5.7 rods, cast factory crank, flattop pistons, 2.02 fuelie heads, solid flat tappett cam, .515 lift @ valve, 242 @ .050, 108, installed @ 104. Air gap intake, Milodon Chevy II oil pan. Dyno test Monday. Looking for a 10 sec Chevy II.
It may be a known element for some but for me, getting to know how to get a 2-bolt block and factory cast crank to survive the RPM I figure needed to pull this off is the real deal here.
I've personally made hundreds of passes on a stock 70's era 350 with factory rods (with ARP hardware) along with the original cast crank but maximum engine RPM was 6000. Maybe 6500. Might have been a 400 HP lump given a 106 trap speed and a 3700 lb all street car.
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Re: Building A Nostalgic 1970s Fuelie Headed 350 SBC

Post by n2omike »

skinny z wrote: Wed May 05, 2021 11:11 am
vortecpro wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 11:22 pm Building a 4.060 X 3.480 360 inch SBC, 618 2 bolt block, factory 5.7 rods, cast factory crank, flattop pistons, 2.02 fuelie heads, solid flat tappett cam, .515 lift @ valve, 242 @ .050, 108, installed @ 104. Air gap intake, Milodon Chevy II oil pan. Dyno test Monday. Looking for a 10 sec Chevy II.
It may be a known element for some but for me, getting to know how to get a 2-bolt block and factory cast crank to survive the RPM I figure needed to pull this off is the real deal here.
I've personally made hundreds of passes on a stock 70's era 350 with factory rods (with ARP hardware) along with the original cast crank but maximum engine RPM was 6000. Maybe 6500. Might have been a 400 HP lump given a 106 trap speed and a 3700 lb all street car.
Stock components with GOOD machine work will withstand a LOT more than most people nowadays give them credit for. If you remember the days before all the 'cheap' Chinese components, stock parts were used in the vast majority of builds, and did just fine. Proper machine work (which isn't always that easy to find) is key. I recently built a budget engine for a buddy with a Gasser. It's a 306ci Ford with stock crank, stock rods w/ARP bolts and hypereutectic pistons. The rev limiter is set on 7600 rpm, and is bounced off it regularly. Ran all season last year, and is still doing great this year.

My 306 with a 200 hp nitrous plate pushed my 3200 lb 1966 4-speed mustang to 9.87 @ 135 in the 1/4. Stock block with Boss 302 crank and rods. Engine was in the car for around 12 years before it bent a few rods from dead hooking on launch with the bottle on... with one of them breaking at the top of the 1/4 mile. Would have still been running great if I would have been wise enough to install a window switch for the bottle. lol. I did do a couple freshen-ups during that time period. (was pump gas, SFT and shifted at 6800 rpm)
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Re: Building A Nostalgic 1970s Fuelie Headed 350 SBC

Post by vortecpro »

skinny z wrote: Wed May 05, 2021 11:11 am
vortecpro wrote: Sat May 01, 2021 11:22 pm Building a 4.060 X 3.480 360 inch SBC, 618 2 bolt block, factory 5.7 rods, cast factory crank, flattop pistons, 2.02 fuelie heads, solid flat tappett cam, .515 lift @ valve, 242 @ .050, 108, installed @ 104. Air gap intake, Milodon Chevy II oil pan. Dyno test Monday. Looking for a 10 sec Chevy II.
It may be a known element for some but for me, getting to know how to get a 2-bolt block and factory cast crank to survive the RPM I figure needed to pull this off is the real deal here.
I've personally made hundreds of passes on a stock 70's era 350 with factory rods (with ARP hardware) along with the original cast crank but maximum engine RPM was 6000. Maybe 6500. Might have been a 400 HP lump given a 106 trap speed and a 3700 lb all street car.

My question is: how is 106 MPH 400 HP @ 3700 pounds?
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Re: Building A Nostalgic 1970s Fuelie Headed 350 SBC

Post by vortecpro »

1980RS wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 8:06 pm
vortecpro wrote: Sun May 02, 2021 8:07 pm
1980RS wrote: Sun May 02, 2021 3:28 pm I would say "no way" but since Mark is building this you can bet he will find a way to make it run what he says it will. :mrgreen:
I'am curious why you would say no way?
Not sure if it's possible at Denver, but at a track closer to sea level I can see it happening. Guys I see at the track where I go have more than 500hp with a light car (3K) and can barely get into the 11's, "you" will have no problem getting into the 10's like you did with your peanut port engine.
There is no way in Denver, I do all my testing in Houston from now on. Testing in a 23.70 baro in Denver is a thing of the past for me :D
Racing a NA NHRA stocker should be mandatory before any posting.
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Re: Building A Nostalgic 1970s Fuelie Headed 350 SBC

Post by vortecpro »

People of this forum: This car runs @ a verified 3590 pounds, based on what you see in this video HOW MUCH CRANKSHAFT HP DOES IT MAKE?


https://youtu.be/v-AZSeDge7U
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